Supra brakes on a Celica?

[GT4 20]

Okay, I fully appreciate that the 330mm rotors from a twin turbo Supra won't bolt straight onto an ST205, but am exploring the possibilities. Does anyone know if the offset of the rotor/hat is the same as the ST205? PCD holes can easily be adapted to suit the Celicas 5 x 100 pattern. I'd also be interested to know what the measurement is between the caliper mounting lugs too.
Cheers
Gary

[wde_bdy]

http://www.dba.com.au/dba_catalogue_2004/HTML/pdf/Out/Toyota.pdf

[GT4 20]

Cheers for the link - that 'idea' goes out of the window
Gary

[wde_bdy]

You used to be able to download their complete catalogue in one pdf file which was quite handy for cross referencing stuff, don't seem to be able to now though. Was very useful for finding discs to work on Toyota TA63 struts with MS65 hubs, Skyline 4 pot calipers and still filt under 15 inch wheels.

Callum

[Frosty]

Try talking to your local brake man.
We have had some awsome results with new rotors and pads, look for thier Temp rating it will tell u how hard they are. EBC make good rotors and pads. (Green for the front and EBC Black on the rear). and apart from the Green Pads are not much more than factory $.
Remember Size Does not matter ( F1 Cars run 13" wheels)
Heat tolerance and the braking systems ability to get rid of this heat is the only thing that matters.
Also have a look at some good brake Fluid, stoping this stuff from exceeding its designed Temp rating is as important.
Shock and suspenstion geomitery also affects stoping power as does Tyres.

[GT4 20]

I'm sure that someone who doesn't need to be taught how to suck eggs will find that info useful
And for the record, EBC Green Stuff pads are cr@p. Wouldn't use them on my pushbike
Gary

[Malcolm]

and size certainly does matter
larger disk size = larger surface area = better heat dissipation, and more mass = better heat sinking ability. Also the further the caliper distance from the center of the hub the more torque it can apply, although it also means the disk will be moving at a higher speed at that point.
Remember Formula 1 cars weight around 700kg (I think), making a big difference to braking needs. Also I wouldn't be suprised if they didn't have the brake disk and caliper inside the wheel like street cars, meaning the brakes could be bigger than a street car with 13" wheels.

[GT4 20]

Not to mention also that F1 cars use carbon brakes.
Gary

[Malcolm]

as in disks, calipers, pads? I would think the heat transfer/dissipation properties of carbon would make them not so suitable for calipers or disks? But then I'm only a learner engineer, so I am probably wrong

[GT4 20]

Brake discs
The carbon brake discs used in Formula 1 may not be thicker than 28 millimetres and their diameter may not exceed 278 millimetres. When braking, the discs heat up to as much as 600 degrees Celsius within a single second.

Brakes
Formula 1 brakes are made of carbon. Under FIA regulations, each wheel is permitted only two brake shoes and a maximum of six pistons. Brake callipers must be made of an aluminium alloy. Cooling fluids, ABS and power-assisted braking are not allowed. Full braking will bring a Formula 1 car from 200 to 0 km/h within 55 metres, all within 1.9 seconds. Deceleration forces achieve up to 5 G – the driver has to endure five times his own weight.

These brakes are extremely expensive as they are made from hi-tech carbon materials (long chain carbon, as in carbon fibre) and they can take up to 5 months to produce a single brake disk. The first stage in making a disc is to heat white polyacrylo nitrile (PAN) fibres until they turn black. This makes them pre-oxidised, and are arranged in layers similar to felt. They are then cut into shape and carbonised to obtain very pure carbon fibres. Next, they undergo two densification heat cycles at around 1000 degrees Celsius. These stages last hundreds of hours, during which a hydrocarbon-rich gas in injected into the oven or furnace. This helps the layers of felt-like material to fuse together and form a solid material. The finished disc is then machined to size ready for installing onto the car.

The main company that makes brakes for F1 cars is Brembo. Carbon discs and pads are more abrasive than steel and dissipate heat better making them advantageous. Steel brakes as used in CART are heavier and have disadvantages in distortion and heat transfer. Metal brake discs weigh about 3 Kg, carbon systems typically 1.4 Kg. Metal brakes are advantageous in some aspects such as 'feel'. The driver can get more feedback from metal brakes than carbon brakes, with the carbon systems often being described like an on-off switch. The coefficient of friction between the pads and the discs can be as much as 0.6 when the brakes are up to temperature. You can often see the brake discs glowing during a race, this is due to the high temperatures in the disc, with the normal operating temperature between 400-800 degrees Celsius.

[Malcolm]

interesting. Thanks for that

[Mr Revhead]

yeah F1 brakes are serious pieces of kit....

another thing to remember is unsprung weight. supra rotors are &$^$ heavy! iv got 2 new jza80 ones here right now.
can take measurements if ya want call me, they are outta here this arvo