How good are GT4?

[mr_monkey]

would take a GTIR over a GT4 anyday

Thats a bold statement It might make good power, and be quicker, but screw owning one. People think changing clutches in GT Fours are bad...

when mine went Midas in chch wanted $1500 total for clutch + install.

-nathan

[EVLGTZ]

would take a GTIR over a GT4 anyday

Thats a bold statement It might make good power, and be quicker, but screw owning one. People think changing clutches in GT Fours are bad...

been there and done it all b4.

plenty of mates who've had them over the years including one whos had his for about 7-8years.

like most cars it all comes down to looking after them and not picking a lemon from the outset

would buy one if could find a mint non thrashed one, but for a car of its age its getting a bit hard

guess me sr20det wagon will have to do for the moment

[Adydas]

I luff my gt4, sad it dont go $&#$% cam belt snapped.

Clutch was naff but for stock i couldnt accept it to do much more, handling.. well if it was good enuf for Carlos Sainz to use in the rally its good enuf for what i can throw at it.

I think the heavey questions been coverd, whats left ? now a days any car with 4wd + turbo = 2 litre + isnt going to be magic on gas is it? be realisitic you cant make power without using fuel can ya?


My gearbox has lasted 194,000 Ks before a rebuild what should i expect from it?

[peas]

I sold my 185 after 2.5 years of ownership... turbo blew, clutch dropped a spring, head gasket blew, cambelt snapped and the thing that finally made me click was the (not so uncommon now I talk to people about it) problem of the clutch pedal bracket tearing. It was then that I decided that I wanted a simpler car that was within my means to repair. My GTZ uses corolla parts on the whole and it simple enough for me to fix up myself without extensive tools or time. If you have the resources... well I still think they are nice cars.

All those faults however you could be forgiven for expecting on a 200k+ car, that had not been maintained as well as it couldve been.

[Spannergal]

had those cambelts been replaced at 100,000km or there abouts? coz if they hadn't then its not completely the cars fault that they snapped. Its means the owner present or previous skimped on maintenance.

Shouldn't be a problem since the car that you are looking at has under 100k on the clock

[peas]

Thank god they are non interference... I had some 20,000k old forgies in there at the time! Didnt replace the belt at the rebuild as it was suppoedly only 35,000k old!

[GT4 20]

Didnt replace the belt at the rebuild

I don't care how old a cambelt is 'supposed' to be. I would always put a new belt on if I was rebuilding an engine!!!!




Anyway, back on topic, most of the replies here seem to be concerning the ST185. IIRC, the original question relates to the ST205

I have had no major issues with mine. It is NZ new with some service history so it has obviously been looked after by previous owners. Sure, I've had to replace a few things, but nothing out of the ordinary for an 12 year old car.
Like most Toyotas, look after it and it'll serve you well. However, thrash it around, abuse it and don't service it correctly and like virtually any other car out there, regardless of make, things will break.
Gary

[RunningRich]

would take a GTIR over a GT4 anyday

Hmm, The *least* successful big (and I mean big) budget rally car ever!

I remember seeing one stuck in the service paddock at the rallly years ago as the decripid gearbox would only give fwd and the wheels just spun on the grass. What a joke. Some people like cheap crappily made econoboxes with big engines, not for me though.

[sergei]

would take a GTIR over a GT4 anyday

.... cheap crappily made econoboxes with big engines.....

good description.

[deaf_rattle]

i remember a good mechanic giving us instructions when we did the clutch in my mates 185rc.

"its harder than a gtir to do the clutch"
"how hard is a gtir?"
"oh they are the hardest"

so gtfour clutch, is harder to do than the hardest.

took the whole engine out in the end, far easier.

even learnt some new words in the process, thanks to the angry beaver

[sergei]

well it is not that hard to do a clutch on GT4. That is if you are pulling engine out.

[DB4G63]

ST205 have a reputation for actually being good and having a decent gearbox. IMHO I think they are much better looking too. There are some real tasteful ones out there and the price usually keeps the younger fools away from them.

A mate of mines ST185 had so much cr@p go wrong with it in relation to drivetrain issues he stopped driving it for quite some time.
A small gearbox cog cost him over 2k once all was said and done.
ST185 gearboxes are well known for poor reliability.
Gaswise?, super guzzlers mainly due to weight.

If you want one? be prepared to put up with mechanical woes (unless some other poor owner has already spent the $$$ )

[crnkin]

supposedly they have a few problems, i know with the st185s, maybe they are the same for the 205's?

Perhaps you'd be wiser stating facts rather than idle gossip and let those who actually own or have owned an ST205 to comment?
Gary

No actually I didnt pull your chain.

Its interesting to see the varying replies. Those who like them basically like the fact it used to be a rally car. Those who hate them are smart. hehe.

[Mr Revhead]

well i find it funny that the one that was the most sucsessful rally car is the one least liked!

the only real common things i get asked for on st185s is rear diff mounts
and body panels!

on the st205, superstrut parts!


other than those parts its just normal service items, cambelts, waterpumps etc etc

i reckon if you find a good st165/185 itd make a good bargin

as for the 205, id own one

[strx7]

well i find it funny that the one that was the most sucsessful rally car is the one least liked!

Exactly, its what I cant understand. As far as rallies entered vs wins & podium finishes the ST185 GT4 is well ahead of WRX's and EVO' and the likes, the only thing that beats it I believe is the Lancia Integrale, and how many people do you hear raving about them?

Toyota dominated the WRC in the early 90's yet alot of people seem to think the car they dominated it with is a P.O.S........... WTF???

i cant wait to get my ST185 going to see who's right and who's wrong.

[dougsop]

Toyota dominated the WRC in the early 90's yet alot of people seem to think the car they dominated it with is a P.O.S........... WTF???

not trying to offend anyone, but i guess thats why all the young ppl like the evo's, WRX STI etc.. while the older ppl will tend to go for GT4.

and i can say that some young PPL out there doesnt knwo wat GT4 is LOL.

i will have to say a good car is sth that will give u good performance PLUS control.. and a GT4 will give u both

[RedMist]

i will have to say a good car is sth that will give u good performance PLUS control.. and a GT4 will give u both

Have you ever driven one? Its not exactly a WRC car, a tonne of component changes would have taken place. Race prep would have also altered the car dramatically... and in my opinion, its not much of a performance car either. It's heavy, doesnt turn in with any dedication. As for control.... you're kidding right? Its probably one of the most unpredictable 4wd cars I have ever been in. The only reason it appears to give control is its been designed to give huge warnings that the ship is going to capsize before it even starts to do anything. But when it snaps, take your twister pointing device and spin it. Wherever the pointer stops is whatever wheel you are going to spin, and you'll understeer of oversteer dependant on that lack of traction. The only thing that probably rescues most people is the fact that is so heavy even in a heavy slip situation it just stays straight.
Keep the car well within its bounds, and it does make a wonderful tourer. It feels good in corner exits where the the 4wd gives you a clean exit. Its the braking, corner entry and that fuggin center diff that dogs the car.

Warrick, let me guess that the panels that you get demand for is front bumpers, front guards and bonnets?
The ST185 is by far the worst Toyota I have ever owned. However i'm still tempted to give a ST205 a spin.

[RunningRich]

It must be noted that the ST185 has a reputation for understeering. Set up properly the ST165 and ST205 do not do this!

[RunningRich]

ST205 have a reputation for actually being good and having a decent gearbox.

ST185 gearboxes are well known for poor reliability.

I'd debate that. You do realise that the only difference between ST165, ST185 and ST205 gearboxes is the ratios and the synchros on the ST205? They are all the same strength.

Again, I'll say that with good oil a good GT-Four gearbox will stay good for a long time if it isn't abused. Do not short shift a GT-Four gearbox, the synchros don't like it.

The only "failure" I have had in a gearbox was the plastic speedo drive ring that failed in response to a failed speedo drive cable.

And the reason no-one here raves about Intergrales is that they are so rare and can no longer be imported (otherwise I'd have one). They are a fantastic car.

[sergei]

It must be noted that the ST185 has a reputation for understeering. Set up properly the ST165 and ST205 do not do this!

I agree, my st165 is very tail happy if given too much gas in the wet, and no understeer (unless it driven in such way)...