Toyspeed.org.nz Message Board

are over powered (160fwkw+) front wheel drives a good thing?
ie those cars that are usually lightweight hatches with a big f off turbo engine crammed in like the 3sgte celica's , 4g63T mirage's , 4agte levin/trueno's... they usually are like a lil tin can , go super fast once you finally get traction after 3rd gear and skip lanes when they come on boost in 4th and 5th... what ya reckon people, good thing or bad thing ??

Depends what you want it for and if you can drive and if you let other people drive it who dont know your car.

In saying that I vote yes because I'm building up a FWD 4AGTE

Are 700HP RWD Skylines a good thing?

HRT wrote:Are 700HP RWD Skylines a good thing?

You dont need anywhere near 700rwhp to make Skidlines useless

I believe Top Gear said it best when they said something along the lines of......

"Front wheel drive, you understeer, so you can't turn. Rear wheel drive, you oversteer, so you turn too much. Rear wheel drive is better because you don't see the tree that kills you."

Personally I think there is 'humour' value in losing traction in a FWD, but losing traction in a RWD allows for a LOT more style.... peeling off a little sideways, or (controlled) fishtailing down a straight, or an arcing sideways turn... my personal belief.

Erelyes wrote:Personally I think there is 'humour' value in losing traction in a FWD, but losing traction in a RWD allows for a LOT more style.... peeling off a little sideways, or (controlled) fishtailing down a straight, or an arcing sideways turn... my personal belief.

I highly agree with that.

And that top gear quote was classic.

Oh and sticking a 3SGTE in a front wheel drive celica GTR, yea ask Jools about that one, hes still having traction issues, lol, 180kw from what i can member,

Al wrote:

HRT wrote:Are 700HP RWD Skylines a good thing?

You dont need anywhere near 700rwhp to make Skidlines useless

In a street car, 700whp is useless in a RWD Skyline - but then it also is with a Supra, and realistically even more useless in an MR2 because its not going to go anywhere unless you are ringing the nuts off it.

IMHO, 350hp is about a sane limit for FWDs (thats still really pretty insane..), about 500hp for a RWD, and 650hp for a AWD.... give or take for the cars weight etc.

I voted "No" for this vote, but thats just because FWDs just.. well.... it just doesn't feel right. I've been in various powerful FWD cars and some haven't been too bad, I'd have to say the VTEC ones and one Supercharged MIVEC one were actually pretty cool, probably because the power comes on so competantly.

1000HP is alright for AWD, go the Option Japan GTR

Of course 700hp is useless in a RWD liner... cause it'll be lightswitch power delivery. The millisecond you hit boost in ANY gear you'll start making smoke.

High HP four-wheel-drives are crazy. In NZPC issue #100 there is a red R32 GTR, fully built, with a T88-33D rated at "over 600hp" (i.e, big $#!&-off turbo, vague idea of how much power it has, but basically 'lots').

Having taken a ride in it, spinning all four wheels with semislick tyres in 2nd (and most of 3rd) gears....

Of course, it didn't make power till 5 grand rpm... so basically really sedate till 5krpm, makes a bit of a whistle, then BAM! hold on for the ride.

Some would say ANY high power street car is 'useless' - as the owner either has to baby it around 99% of the time, facing crap fuel economy... or face loss of licence rather quickly

understeers just so uncool. and torque steer is a pain in the ass in fast FWDs

Nothing wrong with 180fwkw's in my daily driver apart from in the wet its a pain in the ass to get the car moving sometimes.

Its a basic setup thats proven reliable and traction can be controlled with decent suspension and tuning of how hard the boost comes on and when.

Bloody good fun tho

understeer is safer than oversteer, thats why all factory cars understeer.

at least to start with.....

big power is not a problem, what can be a problem is how its delivered... if it comes on in a big rush it can be a bit of a hand full....

interesting selection of opinions...the top gear quote is very true...
so people like EVLGTZ and jools dont regret going fwd then?

flygt4 wrote:so people like EVLGTZ and jools dont regret going fwd then?

well if i was offered pretty much the same setup ive got now but in say an AE86 or better yet a KP60 starlet Id prob be willing to swap

Wouldn't say regret doin what Ive done tho. The car never seems to bore me as its always fun to drive and if a car aint fun to drive then may as well have an auto primera or something.

Hell yeah i got 2 and its endless amounts of fun , but it doesnt matter whether its front or rear just as long as it has more power than all is gud

My cyborg isn't the best handling fwd car, and in the wet don't even try to go fast round corners. Trueno on the other hand is great fun, even in the wet, has less power but the balance is awsome.

FWD cars with lots of power can be fun in straight lines and tourqe steer is a easier way to learn about weight distribution, and can be good fun in the right car.

I dont understand how people can drive reasonably powerful FWD cars. In the dry, yeah sure. Its not so bad.
But in the wet.

I unintentionally get the wheels spinning trying to take off at the lights, even in the 1.3L NA starlet.
And lets be honest, it rains most of the time around here.

In all fairness, a FWD with a decent suspension set up would be fun to drive.
However my vote still goes towards "hell no".

I think a lot of FWD drivers have never driven a RWD before, so they dont know any better.

Compared to driving the MR2 in the wet. I can take off at a reasonable pace without even a hint of wheel spin. Well I dont have to take off any slower than usual if its raining, which I have to do in a FWD.

However, in terms of fun to drive on gravel, I would take my old AE92 over the SW20 any day. That car was a gravel bashing machine. You could get HUGELY sideways, and always pull yourself out of trouble.

its all in the technique.... both are fun...

if you cant help but wheel spin in a 1300starship... tryign NOT dumping the clutch!

RomanV wrote:I dont understand how people can drive reasonably powerful FWD cars.
Compared to driving the MR2 in the wet. I can take off at a reasonable pace without even a hint of wheel spin. Well I dont have to take off any slower than usual if its raining, which I have to do in a FWD.

dont think an sw20 is a very good comparison in the wet.. FWD is a fair bit safer.. atleast you get your steering back when you ease off the power! as for spin, really dosent take much provoking in mr2

MrBob wrote:dont think an sw20 is a very good comparison in the wet.. FWD is a fair bit safer.. atleast you get your steering back when you ease off the power!

Yeah, the MR2 is a little different to most RWDs because of its weight distribution, but the principle's the same...

When you 'ease off the power' in a RWD (even an mr2) you get your steering back, unless you've REALLY overcooked it. Just like a FWD.

But that's the thing - if you break traction in a FWD, you'll have *no* steering - as the steering and driving wheels are the same.

Whereas in a RWD, you can overpower the driving wheels and still be able to steer. (This is often referred to as "drift". )

That said, it is a lot more difficult to completely overcook things in a FWD. Wrenching the wheel and planting the foot usually just results in the car sludging forward. Doing the same in a RWD sends you into a doughie

Mr Revhead wrote:its all in the technique.... both are fun...

if you cant help but wheel spin in a 1300starship... tryign NOT dumping the clutch!

Nah, seriously! I think its due to the completely rooted shocks in the front. It starts to spin, and then I get some mean wheel hop going on.

Completely unintentional, and yes I do know how to drive properly.

It was probably more to do with the suspension than anything, but it still sucks