Toyspeed.org.nz Message Board

After reading a paper outlining the success that Portugal has had in tackling their drug related problems by decriminalising them in 2001, and comparing that situation to increasing drug use rates in countries with more draconian drug policies, I wondered what other Toyspeeders thought of the current legal treatment in New Zealand?

Is the current criminal status of substances, such as Marijuana, the best way to tackle drug abuse problems?

Or should we follow the example of Portugal and decriminalise them in order to focus on the rehabilitation and education of people that abuse drugs?

(note: the Portugal example does not condone drug use, it simply states that the best way to tackle the problem is with decriminalisation. I would like this debate to follow the same path- It is not a debate about the merits of drugs or otherwise, it is simply a debate on the most effective way to tackle drug abuse)

(Portugal example: http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=10080)

Your thoughts?

I dont smoke weed, but I am aware that the courts spend millions of dollars on enforcing minor victimless offences such as being in possesion of weed or smoking it.

Provided there are laws to back it up, ie no driving under the influance of substances and increased penalties if commiting a crime (and being high at the same time).

How about allowing gangs to be sellers of it, they can make money and hopefully stop them from turning to more serious crimes for income.

Everyone wins

We need to start thinking outside the squar eon this and many other issues in our society, because what we have now isnt working.

decriminalise and let the govt tax it. Makes govt happy but pushes gangs out of one market and lets them focus more on meta.
Then again, all money that is currently used for weed can be pushed back on fight against meta.

At the moment isn't the law written that you can't be done for driving while on drugs in the way you can be done for drink driving? (they can charge you with reckless driving or something like that?)

Seeing as i don't use/sell/have anything to do at all with drugs i couldn't careless is they made rules and regs tougher. I do however like the idea of making it legal so that the government can tax the crap out of it and spend the money on healthcare etc

massivly increase the penalties for dealers to deter dealing
not just a few months
by years. life for repeat. and life means life. and bring back capital punishment. can be used for class A substances.
get ruthless and you will have more results than by using wet bus tickets like they do now.

and more education about the health and social hazards. currently nz has a society that see's getting wasted as being cool. it's not.

massivly increase the penalties for dealers to deter dealing
not just a few months
by years. life for repeat. and life means life. and bring back capital punishment. can be used for class A substances.
get ruthless and you will have more results than by using wet bus tickets like they do now.

and more education about the health and social hazards. currently nz has a society that see's getting wasted as being cool. it's not.

hear hear, one thing this country has lost is fear in its justice system, criminals need to fear the justice system in order for it to work as a crime deterrant.

Sure some people will break the law regardless and goto jail, but those that do should be made example of so that others do not follow that path.

It may take time, and prison populations will grow big time but it will eventually work.

3 things I think that would towards a more effective law and order \ policing system

1) tent prisons for less than violent offending, cheap, effective and frees up space for putting more serious offenders away for longer

2) prisoner outsourcing for serious crimes (murder, rape, violent assualt)
pay Thailand 1/2 the amount ($40,000) to keep them behind bars for twice as long at no extra cost. They cannot reoffend if they are not back in society.

3) bring back effective self defence rights, the state should be responsible for enforcing the law, we should be responsible for our own protecting our lives until police arrive on scene.

Mr Revhead wrote:massivly increase the penalties for dealers to deter dealing
not just a few months
by years. life for repeat. and life means life. and bring back capital punishment. can be used for class A substances.
get ruthless and you will have more results than by using wet bus tickets like they do now.

and more education about the health and social hazards. currently nz has a society that see's getting wasted as being cool. it's not.

once again, warwick gets my vote for pm!

drugs are fine

drug abuse (people) is a problem. remarkably similar to guns / cars etc

moderation etc

IMO if you need to turn to drugs to make you happy then your life must be pretty sad!

B1NZ wrote:IMO if you need to turn to drugs to make you happy then your life must be pretty sad!

...Thats usually the case

except for Cocaine. You only get addicted to that when your lief is awesome. I agree with Deecee

I couldnt be arsed reading the portugal thing, did they legalise everything, like could you walk to the diary and buy some P?

I guess it may cost million to the justice system to deal with these losers, but the cost would only mulitply and trasfer to mental healthcare if they opened up the floodgates.

Lol, I have no idea if this idea was the norm at the time, but I was just thinking about the idea that my parents had about smoking, when my brother thought he might give it a go they were going to make him smoke a whole pack, he was like 6 or something. He got half way through the first one and just about died, it was hilarious. He now smokes, but that is beside the point, I wonder what would happen if we gave similar punushments to people caught with drugs, like make them have heaps in a real short space of time till they die or something.

This is the shitest idea I have had for a while, but I spent time typing it out so dont want to have wasted that time.

Our currently legal most abundant drug causes no problems at all... so we might as well legalise the whole lot.

...Alcohol

Decriminalising != Legalising

B1NZ wrote:IMO if you need to turn to drugs to make you happy then your life must be pretty sad!

you make it sound like the two are interdependent

you think happy people never take drugs?

rollaholic wrote:

B1NZ wrote:IMO if you need to turn to drugs to make you happy then your life must be pretty sad!

you make it sound like the two are interdependent

you think happy people never take drugs?

I consider them a personal choice, I don't take them myself nowadays but I won't judge people for doing so. As long as the result of said drug taking doesnt result in crimes or unnecessary drain on the health system then I reckon its the individuals choice as to what they want to put in their body.

I know many happy people who takes drugs, a lot of them live really amazing lives. they all take them for different reasons, some as a social lubricant, some just want to try a different experience for a few hours, much like people who indulge in adrenaline seeking sports.

As stated, the prosecutions for lower level drug related crimes consume a massive amount of money going through the courts every year. New Zealand has always had a stubborn attitude of "if it aint broke, dont fix it" but the resources currently used up by this could be far better used in some other part of the system.

IMO weed should be decriminilised, (not legalised)

im sure alcohol dose more damage than weed. i.e drunk drivers, fights stuff like that.

smoking 1 joint is as bad as smoking 3 cigarets.

i think it should be legal i dont do drugs wont say i havent had the occasional joint in my life better than alcohol what happens when a bunch of people get stonned they do nothing then eat and are sweet get a bunch of people drunk and the affects can get violent angry ect then they get arrested and take up tax payers money at the hospital or police station

What do you predict would happen if they made all drugs free and legal to be consumed at the pharmacy?

I would say firstly the junkies could sort their lives out, not having to commit crimes to pay off the dealers etc
Then the gangs would be out of business and have no reason to get more people hooked in the future.

Brilliant idea, then when their lives get messed up even more it makes it easier for them to find God....as a mate of mine told me a few years back after visiting the local AOG, relegion is for people who can't handle drugs.

Steve

God, the imaginary friend for adults!



How could relaxing rules a round problem make it better?
Lets take away all the rules to do with street racing and dodgy modifying of cars and see what happens