Best 4AGE for converting to turbo?

[Stealer Of Souls]

obviously, with a turbo car you're going to have "lag".
But.. when racing, you should always be in the right rpm range, where you can modulate the power required with throttle

While in principle I agree 100% with all this argument.
When you're a beginner it's a bit tough to get it right all the time. So you're more likely to just let the revs drop out of the range where you're getting useful boost. So a car that is good off-boost (or one that makes boost REAL low ie SC) is good for a beginner.

[suberimakuri]

cool..... must be mutha turbo to let it drop that low, else low revs.

even with t3/4 we would have usable boost by 4000rpm, and 4000->8000rpm is a big band.

[Mr Revhead]

hahaha

real motorsports some times require finesse and careful use of the throttle... thats when throttle response is important.....

in a tight group of cars, in a long sweeper, you cant just nail it.....
real racing is totally different from drifting!

[Stealer Of Souls]

4-8 is a nice big power band. But as a beginner (myself) I find I have trouble driving in the 4-8 range unless it's a straight. I have the nasty habit of road driving between 2.5 and 5. Now I'm not racing any official races and I am still gaining experience by attending track days and some nice twisty 100kph bits of road. But that's how I find myself driving.
So for a person like me having good response in the lower rev region will be more useful. At least initially.

Oh yeah... just for the record I'm only pottering around with a stock blue top...

[suberimakuri]

compression doesn't affect response as much as turbo selection and advance.

i'm not saying bad response is ok... the better resp. the better.
call drifting what you will, but you still have to get the car to turn in and hold it on the edge of spin and no spin.
when you start running out of opposite lock you've got to be careful... as you do when changing directions.
you can't just stand on it and expect good things to happen.

If i didn't think much of throttle response, then I wouldn't have changed from a turbo setup to a NA setup for the track.


stealer of souls: i understand what you're saying.
Rather then building your car to be good down to 2000rpm when you know that you shouldn't get that low... why not just concentrate on trying to get the gearing in the corner right?

[pc]

If your "racing" on a track, you shouldn't be using your opposite lock at all.... if your doing that its called drifting not racing.

[suberimakuri]

i was trying to give an example of where throttle response & control(read below) is critical for drifting.
And if you've never raced or been to a race on any track, then you obviously would think that opposite lock is never used in racing.
You should have watched the sidecar footage on the weekend.

I don't know any motor racing where you can be lead foot and get away with it........ maybe downhill derby

-

This conversation changed from throttle response (engine mechanical) to throttle control (technique) a while ago.
Unless someones got something new to say, I'm staying with my recommendation for turbo bluetop.

[vvega]

if you really are that new to racing perhaps your better off to go with the bluetop n/a style till you get the technical side of track sorted and then move up to more power

a bluetop would suit this since you can race it as it is then bolt on a turbo later on as your ability increases

a revy engine will tech you to keep it on the burn and how to "balance" the car in corners on the loud button

remember racing ant about power its about ability
all types of racing require a level of skill that is only obtained by practice on technice
its hard to practice when your scared to use the gas mid corner cause your skill levcel isnt enought to stop that 170 odd kw from mmaking you race the wrong way

i have to say i agree with karl in respect of choice of motor but perhaps n/a to start with

remeber ken evans(kinloud) won his race series last year with a bluetop and he had some stiff oposition

just my thoughts


v

[suberimakuri]

mm

[pc]

I agree with vvega here. learning how to drive fast in a car without oodles of power is a good place to start. It means you have to work harder on driving technique to get the lap times down. It also gets you concentrating on some of the other important stuff that some people forget like break points/technique, tyre choice/pressures, and suspension setup.

And if you've never raced or been to a race on any track, then you obviously would think that opposite lock is never used in racing.

I was mearly implying that if using opp lock while racing then you cocked up and took the slow way round the corner... maybe I should have elaborated

[Stealer Of Souls]

I agree with vvega here too...
I think it's best to learn the limits of a car/driver with less power (generally means less repair bills). That's my general plan/idea. Right now I'm just trying to get as much track time as possible to learn to handle my car (and myself) and then I plan to build more power...


And Karl. I see what your saying... I'm working on it... I'll get the gear choices right someday...

[Drifter4ag]

example ...
learning how to drive in a car with oodles of power

karl S and I used to have small light weight toyotas pushing 250-300hp for track use...
...we are now running bone stock forms of 4age and 3sge with quad throttle setups ..

Learning in your car with massive PS teaches you how the car handles at speed and the limits on cornering etc... when you drop it down to less than 1/2 what you had before you get to learn how to keep it at speed without relying on the power to get you there.
While it makes drifting harder for us it makes grip racing much easier.

[Stealer Of Souls]

So Drifter4AG.
Knowing what you know now, what would you say is a better way to do it. Lots of power first or start with less power and work your way up?

[Mr Revhead]

ummm yeah.....

you dont need a hugely powerful car to learn limits... in fact a lower power car will teach you more about skill.... cause power can be used to compensate for many things.... start low, then work up, thats why racing schools use low power cars and work upwards.... you dont start off in the top classes!

[MetalupYoAss]

Yeah, too many drifters rely on power to enter/hold drift... in actual fact its all about weight shifting.. fact: you dont need big power to drift

[suberimakuri]

sure Revhead, if you don't have power then you have to work harder.

But, if you drive something with lots of power and concentrate on how more power can make a car step out, and you'll be finding the power induced limits more often.... the power will save your bacon sometimes.

in other words.. driving with big power can quickly advance you in some areas, and then when you go back to low power you notice other things and can work the car better. This has been my experience.

Driving a high power car makes some things happen that are more controllable then a big chuck... ie: the on power straight line wheelspin in 3rd, 4th, etc.. that DOESN'T happen in a low power car.