failed cam belt, bent valve

[anthrax2]

So basically my cam belt failed a few days ago, it has a bent valve and the 'head' is in the process of being opened to inspect for furthur damage. I dont really know what I'm talking about
Anyway I'd really appreciate some opinions and experience of how much this is going to cost, right now I feel like they could tell me any price and I'd have no idea.

[Dell'Orto]

Ouch, what sort of engine? Depending on what damage is has caused, and theres no way to tell til the head is off, could be anything from just a bent valve to holes in pistons and damage to the head. Sad to say, but its not going to be cheap either way, particularly with paying workshop labour.

[anthrax2]

toyota celica - 5S-FE ..... ouch

[Malcolm]

there's a 3S-FE head on trademe, should be the same or very similar I think. Cheaper than a rebuild

[2LTR Rona]

Ouch, what sort of engine? Depending on what damage is has caused, and theres no way to tell til the head is off, could be anything from just a bent valve to holes in pistons and damage to the head. Sad to say, but its not going to be cheap either way, particularly with paying workshop labour.

Second that, same thing had happened before I brought the KE25 (Blue top 4AGE) Removed head, sourced another from a wrecker (whole head including intake manifold etc $80 mates rates though ) sent the two off to Engine Rebuilders in New Plymouth got them to sort one good one out of the two, result was two bent valve stems....all in all was about $300 odd all up from memory once i got them back.

I know they are different blocks etc but gives ya some sort of idea

[KinLoud]

Toyota petrol motors are usually non interference (this means that if the cam belt breaks the valves won't get bent by the piston.
I would be surprised if your valves got bent when the cambelt broke.
However if the belt broke due to the camshaft seizing then you might need to find another head due to other damage to the camshaft and bearings etc.
The 2.2L 5sfe engine is found in most Camry motors from the early 90's
There should be loads of them around!

Ken
Ham
021 408 863

[anthrax2]

Thanks for your help guys. I went back to the mechanic today, bad news.
14 out of the 16 valves are bent, some parts are off somewhere (engine reconditioners?) and they are going to let us know how much it is going to cost on Monday - the mechanic gave me a rough estimate of $2,000. I'm feeling pretty gutted (only 17, 2 grand is a lot of money)
THe car itself is worth roughly $3000-3500. If you have any suggestions, please let me know, I.E. how much would it cost to just buy a second hand engine and have this put in, instead of fixing what is there? Also what do you think of his estimate? - I will know this for sure on Monday.

[Adydas]

Drop a turbo motor in it.

[Ae92typeX]

sounds like a realistic price...
you would be able to get a used engine for less- but if you have to pay someone to fit as well as getting a new belt/pump etc( which you would want to on a used engine) it wont work out any less imo.

[sergei]

second hand engine for that is arround $300-$600 for good with warranty from wreckers

[sergei]

he is looking at about a grand+gst for engine swap... (based on my personal experience)...

[anthrax2]

Hang on just a sec. From what KinLoud said - "Toyota petrol motors are usually non interference" After doing some research I have found this to be true for the 5S-FE as well. "Pistons are made of high temperature–resistant aluminum alloy, and a depression is built into the piston
head to prevent interference with the valves. " (excert from toyota manual, found on another forum)
I dont know if i'm being silly here or what, but I'm not so sure about this mechanic. Today he said to me that basically he doesnt know but a mate of his told him these engines shouldnt bend valves when the cam fails. Could it be possible he is looking at it wrong here?

[solberg Fan]

Im sure the piston wouldnt be designed to be non interferance just in case the cam belt broke. Its more likely the piston has been designed with the depression for performance, economy reasons.
What KinLoud said is true, the 5-SFE is a non-inference engine. So the valves shouldnt bentd if the cam belt broke. Even if the cam sezied i cant see how the valves would bend. But im sure there must be more to the story.

[Ae92typeX]

he is looking at about a grand+gst for engine swap... (based on my personal experience)...

second hand engine for that is arround $300-$600 for good with warranty from wreckers

If the engine is stuffed (if) then that would be the go then. I didnt know the exact wrecker price- was looking round 1g + new parts like waterpump etc etc then labour.

I dont know if i'm being silly here or what, but I'm not so sure about this mechanic. Today he said to me that basically he doesnt know but a mate of his told him these engines shouldnt bend valves when the cam fails. Could it be possible he is looking at it wrong here?

..
14 out of the 16 valves are bent, some parts are off somewhere (engine reconditioners?)...

so did he say 14 are bent or he does not know?

[anthrax2]

Sorry, he told me 14 are bent- the doesnt know part was whether the 5S-FE engine bends valves or not. I'm probably just being paranoid here, still in denial lol.

[Malcolm]

I wouldn't bother rebuilding, just replace it with a good 2nd hand motor. If you're in Aucks I think I know someone who would install the engine for around $500 cash

[fivebob]

How can you bend 14 valves when the cam belt breaks?

Even if it was an interference engine, which the 5S-FE is not, you'd bend 2 or, at the most, 4 valves, maybe 6 at the absolute maximum, but 14...never.

Something is not right here

[Ae92typeX]

Sorry, he told me 14 are bent- the doesnt know part was whether the 5S-FE engine bends valves or not. I'm probably just being paranoid here, still in denial lol.

well...'if' 14 valves are bent, than it does answer his question really (if)...unless the mechanic dropped the head when he removed it and bent it lol

How can you bend 14 valves when the cam belt breaks?

Even if it was an interference engine, which the 5S-FE is not, you'd bend 2 or, at the most, 4 valves, maybe 6 at the absolute maximum, but 14...never.

Something is not right here

and 'if' 14 are bent and it is non interference than something more major has occured (although I cant imagine what) and the damage would make it uneconomical to repair


How did ya break it? just driving casually, or booting around a little harder?

[malc]

the belt on my 4age broke about a month ago
no damage to report, had it up and running the next day

I went back to the mechanic today, bad news.
14 out of the 16 valves are bent,

Today he said to me that basically he doesnt know

sounds like you need a new mechanic more than you need new valves

[wde_bdy]

Fivebob (as usual) is totally right.
Think how an engine works, with a 4 cyclinder engine each cylinder is going to be in a stage of the combustion process -
intake - inlet valves open
compression - all valves closed
power - all valves closed
exhaust - exhaust valves open
Even if in crossover when the cam belt breaks there is no way you could have that many valves hit the pistons unless the cambelt jumped enough teeth to throw the cam timing way out before it broke.

Callum