Engine Codes - Discussion

[darkwolf]

One thing that pisses me off is people who compare Toyota Engine Codes to Nissan Engine codes by calling a Twin Turbo 2JZ a 2JZ-GTTE.

Had a discussion with a friend on the weekend about this and I came to the conclusion that:

An engine code refers to the engine itself. NOT the exhaust or intake systems.

With that in mind it would be fitting to understand that Toyota (unlike Nissan) couldn't really give a toss about how many turbos are put behind the engine as long as they have heavier duty internals in the engine (the 'T' in 3S-GTE) etc.

This would also lead onto the idea that there is a lot of head work in an engine to run EFI on a Carby engine, thus we have an 'E' for an EFI head.

Now one of the questions that this idea raises is:
Are there different internals run for a turbo vs a supercharged engine. And if not, then why have a 'T' for turbo and a 'Z' for supercharged.

Which leads me onto thinking that the section A of the Engine code would be for the block and section B of the code would be head design.

Section A-> 4A (hence the '-' as a separator) GE <- Section B

But in this case are there noticeable differences in head design that would warrant a different letter where N/A and Forced Induction are concerned?

AND if this is true then why are there not different codes for VVT, VVT-i, and Dual VVT-i? Surely the head construction is vastly different for each one?

So I guess my questions are?

Why doesn't Toyota refer to the twin turbo in it's engine code?
My thoughts are because single, twin, or quad, it makes no difference to be build of the engine.

Why does Toyota have different codes for 2 different FI systems (turbo vs SC)?
? Because they can? Or there maybe a difference (compression etc maybe)

Why isn't there a different code for VVT-i, VVT, and Dual VVT-i?
Because it doesn't change the block? But then AFAIK neither would EFI so then Why? Compression again?

We also got into if somebody takes a 4A-GE and adds a turbo does this then change the engine code (bearing in mind there have been no other modifications) or is it simply a 4A-GE with a turbo?
I could argue both sides here but I don't think I'd win either

Feel free to completely disagree with what I have said as it is purely just my ponderings. But it kinda made sense to me.

[flygt4]

whoa you're looking way too deep into it.

they just need a name for the engine so replacement parts can be sourced easily. so for 3sgte, if you need to order pistons/turbo etc etc they can supply you with the right one and not parts from a 3sge.

also theres a reason toyota ask for a chassis number when you order parts, so they can identify what version engine/suspension you have and require parts for.

[sergei]

The system is quiet old, so hence inconsistencies. Typically there is difference in heads on EFI vs Carb (injector holes not drilled through - that is if they are in the head, hole for the fuel pump etc.)...

[cogent]

the chassis code ties into it as well

AW11 - 4A-GE
SW20 - 3S-GE
KE70 - #K

[solitaire]

I the the naming convention is quite clever...

i like the way for the chassis it goes engine - family - revision... Lend in idea of how much heritage there is in my old ae92

[GTTpower]

Quite a few people get these starlet codes wrong too, confuse them with body styles.
KP60=2K
KP61=4K
KP62=3K

Cant blame them tho, weird way of naming them.

[darkwolf]

That's awesome - never actually looked into that...

Does anyone know the diesel codes to Corona wagons? Or is that the exception that breaks the rule?

[Jason T]

Does anyone know the diesel codes to Corona wagons? Or is that the exception that breaks the rule?

CT170 = http://english.auto.vl.ru/catalog/toyota/corona/1989_11/4262/

CT190= http://english.auto.vl.ru/catalog/toyota/caldina/1992_11/2135/

origionally posted by ma71supraturbo:

You may have noticed people throwing around obscure letter/number combinations like JZA70, MA71, 1JZ-GTE, 7M-GE etc, but to you these codes mean nothing. If that is the case, look no further than this FAQ.

Let’s first start out with Toyota Chassis Codes. While they may seem totally random especially if you are comparing two different models, Toyota used a system fairly consistently that allows one to easily identify the vehicle and equipment based on each digit. Perhaps the most common Toyota chassis code belongs to the Toyota Corolla GTS (AE86). (In Japan, and in trendy US suburbs, people often abbreviate this to the “hachi roku” – Japanese for “8 6.”)

The "A" stands for the engine -- 4A-GE
The "E" is Toyota's chassis designation for the Corolla
The "86" is the chassis designation for those model years (1983-1987 Toyota Corolla GTS. The lower-grade model was called the 85 -- hachi-go -- in Japan).

Now look at another car from that time period sharing the same engine -- the 1st generation MR2 (AW11):

"A" for the 4A-GE engine
"W" for the MR2 chassis
"11" for the boxy chassis from 85-89

Here’s the 2nd generation MR2 (SW20 / 21):

"S" for the 3SG(T)E (the NA car had a 5S-FE in the US, but still was an "S" block)
“W” for the MR2 chassis
"20" or "21" depending on turbo or NA for 1991-1998

Starting to get the hang of it? Now lets move on to the 1st generation Supra (MA46 / 47):

“M” is for the 4M-E engine used in 1979-1980 (1981 engines got a 5M-E)
“A” is the Supra chassis.
“46” is for the 1979-1980 4M-E equipped Mk1’s, while “47” is for the 1981 models with the 5M-E

Second generation Supra (MA61 / 67, GA61):

“M” is for the 5M-GE engine, “G” is for the 1G-GE engine offered in other countries
“A” is the Supra chassis.
“61” is the Mk2 chassis for non-US use, “67” were U.S. Mk2's (“61” can still be found on the chassis though)

Whew, time for our beloved Mk3’s (MA70 / 71, GA70, JZA70)

"M" for the 7M-G(T)E, “G” is for the 1G-GTE engine option in other countries, and “JZ” is for the 1JZ-GTE engine offered in other countries.
"A" is the Supra chassis
"70" was the 86.5-92 chassis (71 being turbo, but only on the VIN – at least in the US)

And the car that many of us love to hate, the 4th generation Supra (JZA80):

”JZ” for the 2JZ-G(T)E
“A” for the Supra chassis
“80” for the 93.5-98 body style (they did not delineate turbo/non)

So what about these engine codes? The first digit (a number) denotes the generation of the engine. The "M" series engine, for example, dates back to the Toyota 2000GT and had been used in many sporty/luxury cars for the better part of 30 years. Each new number denotes some change to the engine. For example, the Supra saw these “M” engines from 1979 to 1992:

4M-E 2.6 liter SOHC 2-valve head (1979-1980)
5M-E 2.8 liter SOHC 2-valve head (1981)
5M-GE 2.8 liter DOHC 2-valve head (1982-1986)
6M-GE 3.0 liter DOHC 2-valve head (not used in Supras, but found in JDM Crowns in the mid 80’s)
7M-G(T)E 3.0 liter DOHC 4-valve head (1986.5-1992)

In contrast, the "JZ" series only has two versions to date (and by the looks of current trends, probably will only have two):

1JZ-G(T)E 2.5 liter DOHC 4-valve head (1991-1992 – but used later in other models)
2JZ-G(T)E 3.0 liter DOHC 4-valve head (1993.5-1998 – also used in other models)

Typically Toyota will stroke an engine to achieve a new block number, but often head changes go along with it. For example, the 1JZ head actually flows better than the 2JZ head, but isn't as nice on emissions. Since the 2JZ was coming to the states, the head had to be changed…

The next digit(s) (a letter/ letters) in the engine code refers to the block itself. "M," "A," and "S," are examples of single digit blocks. Toyota started using two digit block names in the early 90's including: “JZ” and “UZ” (Toyota/Lexus V

The next digit (the first after the dash) designates the head design. "G" is the DOHC performance head, generally with a more aggressive valve angle for higher rpm/more power. "F" is the low-end torque and fuel-efficient DOHC head, with less aggressive valve angles. If there is neither an “F” or “G” in that digit, then the engine is a SOHC model (probably chain-driven). Toyota did make a few OHV engines, but they are much older and by now quite rare.

The next digit is for forced induction. "T" denotes a turbocharged model, but unlike Nissan, Toyota does not add an extra "t" for twin turbo versions. If the engine is supercharged (88-89 MR2 and some Toyota Previa Minivans, for example), it will have a “Z” instead.

The last digit "E," means the car has electronic fuel injection. If the “E” is missing, the car is carbureted.

A recap of the M-series history:

4M-E 2.6 liter SOHC 2-valve head with EFI
5M-E 2.8-liter SOHC 2-valve head with EFI
5M-GE 2.8-liter DOHC 2-valve head with EFI
6M-GE 3.0 liter DOHC 2-valve head with EFI
7M-G(T)E 3.0 liter DOHC 4-valve head with EFI

Another example is the “22R” engine commonly found in older four cylinder Toyota Pickups. If the engine is a 22R-E, it has EFI. If it is just a 22R, you’re stuck with a carb.

There are also a few archaic designations that you might come across, especially if the engine is from the late 70’s or early 80’s. A “C” in the engine code means that engine met California emissions requirements (e.g. 4A-GEC). An “L” in the engine code means that engine was mounted transversely (e.g. 4A-GELC). And a “U” means that engine was equipped with an oxygen sensor so it could only be run on unleaded gas (e.g. 4A-ELU).

http://toymods.net/forums/showthread.php?t=309

[matt dunn]

The only engine I know that came out with a GZE and a GTE version from factory,

was the 1GGTE and 1GGZE, and yes they are differewnt internally.

The GZE had pistons that are made of the same material
( forged/semi/Whateverthehellyouwant) as the 4AGZE pistons,
The GTE were weaker more like the material in the 3SGTE pistons.

so that's why the two different versions.

Did you know what the rest of chassis codes mean?

AE92-BCMXR

AE92 is obvious,

B= Trueno A= levin,
C = coupe, 2 door,
M = Manual
X = Supercharged
R = Spec level, ie R has wind up windows etc.

That's all I can remember as that what I owned when I worked in the parts dept at toyota.

[AE86less]

So my AE82 - EGMQF is

E - Corolla?
G - 3 door hatch
M - Manual
Q - 4age?
F - F spec level (power mirrors, windup windows..)


I think Darkwolf's musings are mainly correct except that his "two sections" are not actually restricted to Head and Block sections. It's an interesting point about 4age turbos etc though.

[Mr Revhead]

yeah the rest of the number:
1st digit = model, eg corolla, sprinter, carib etc.
2nd digit= body style, 3 dr 5dr wagon etc
3rd digit= trans type, manual or auto etc, also related to no of gears.
4th digit= engine
5th digit= spec eg, gt, gl etc

[xsspeed]

so whats the diff between ae80/81/82? different specs?

[Mr Revhead]

it seems around 87 they changed things a little

still pretty much the same, except for the 82 they used E for corolla, and after 87ish they used A
and F for sprinter then B

[Truenotch]

I think you are reading into it waaay too much DarkWolf .... Theres not that much to it really.


And the internals (minus pistons) + head are the same between the Smallport 4AGE and the Smallport 4AGZE.... Yet the codes are different? Internals have nothing to do with the code of the engine.

Thats why 4age bluetop bigport, smallport, redtop bigport, Silvertop and blacktop are all 4AGE's. And also the 2 different 4AGZE's have different internals and heads but are both 4agze's.


So the Z and the T do have things to do with the ancillaries on the engine. But only if they are to do with forced induction. Looking into the possibilities of extra letters meaning a difference in head design etc doesn't work at all.

[Lloyd]

The annoying bit should be people that dont know where the dash goes, an in the difference between a 1GZ-FE and a 1G-ZFE is that one would be a 5L V12 and the other is a supercharged 2L IL6 (yes I know one is production engine and the other isn't before someone says that).

The Toyota naming systems is a hell of a lot better than the majority of manufacturers out there.

[Snoozin]

4K-J = auto choke

Yeah.

With reference to the above, a 1G-ZFE wouldn't exist anyway even if it was a proddy engine, the F would precede the Z...

[Lloyd]

Indeed

Regardless, its still annoying

[strx7]

so whats the diff between ae80/81/82? different specs?

AE80 has a 2A engine
AE81 has a 3A engine
AE82 has a 4A engine

ST170 corona has a 4S engine 1800
ST171 has a 3S engine 2000

ST183 celica has a 3S
ST184 celica has a 5S 2.2
ST185 has a 2 litre and is 4WD

all Numbers, and letters in japanese chassis codes equate to something

[Akane]

We also got into if somebody takes a 4A-GE and adds a turbo does this then change the engine code (bearing in mind there have been no other modifications) or is it simply a 4A-GE with a turbo?
I could argue both sides here but I don't think I'd win either

FINALLY!

I'm sick of kiddies saying "I've built a 4A-GTE"

Seriously, WTF is a 4A-GTE, it tells me NOTHING about the internals of the engine except it's from a 4A-G family, is it a GZE? or did you turbo the N/A Block?

STOP MAKING UP YOUR OWN ENGINE CODES.

I'm fine with people calling it 4A-GE Turbo'd
Or 4A-GZE Turbo'd

Not 4A-GTE or 4A-G(T)E. and certainly not a 4A-GZTE.

Seriously a big W.T.F

[Mr Revhead]

you know what pisses me off

"iv got a four age"

its 4 A. G. E.



$&#$% kids these days!