F1 2008!!!

[Mr Revhead]

not quite like that
manufacturers can build their own engines
just to a design set down and controlled by whoever wins the tender
so they will be branded different brands, but be the same engine

[2jayzgte]

Is'nt this a big cost cutting measure I think I saw a article with Max Moseley saying that F1 needed to cut costs drastically to survive anyways.But I can see the points everyone is making though but at the end of the day I think the sports in trouble so I suppose they have to start somewhere.

[thornz]

Well, cant belive I missed half of top gear for that snooze fest. Honestly one of the more boring races this season.

Interesting though some of the comments they made about the standard engines, James Allen was saying that the engines were going to be made by one engine supplier, and the contract was out for tender.

[rolla_fxgt]

Seems Ferrari have started making noises that they are looking at dropping out of F1 if the changes go ahead.

Which I read to actually mean, if we don't win the contract to supply everyone then we'll throw a girly hissy fit and quit to sulk in the corner.

Lets see if the FIA really does stand for Ferrari International Assistance, or if they have the balls to do what's in the best interests of the sport, not just the interests of Ferrari

[fivebob]

Seems Ferrari have started making noises that they are looking at dropping out of F1 if the changes go ahead.

Which I read to actually mean, if we don't win the contract to supply everyone then we'll throw a girly hissy fit and quit to sulk in the corner.

Lets see if the FIA really does stand for Ferrari International Assistance, or if they have the balls to do what's in the best interests of the sport, not just the interests of Ferrari

Actually it's in the best interests of the sport not to have a control engine. Ferrari is not the only one that would leave F1 if that were the case, Toyota, BMW, Mercedes, Honda and Renault have all said they would likely leave F1 if it becomes a control engine class. Which just leaves Williams, Red Bull/Toro Rosso, Force India, and possibly McLaren on the grid?

With the huge loss of sponsorship, fan base and general interest in F1 that would result from such an absurd change F1 would die pretty quickly, Just like CART did. Motorsport does not need another control class like A1GP.

Though my guess is that the manufacturers would form a breakaway series not under the control of the FIA and we might actually get to see what F1 should be when it's not the Max and Bernie circus

[rolla_fxgt]

Actually it's in the best interests of the sport not to have a control engine. Ferrari is not the only one that would leave F1 if that were the case, Toyota, BMW, Mercedes, Honda and Renault have all said they would likely leave F1 if it becomes a control engine class. Which just leaves Williams, Red Bull/Toro Rosso, Force India, and possibly McLaren on the grid?

Oh I agree F1 doesn't need a control engine or gearbox or bodywork, or any of the other weird & wonderful ideas that have been proposed.

But whereas the others seem to be working within the system to persuade the FIA that this is a bad idea, Ferrari just goes out straight away & says they're not going to be in F1 if they don't get their way.
I believe in working with the system to find a solution, and only using threats as the last resort.

I've also read about other teams including McLaren, Renault, and Toyota getting some traction with the FIA on other cost reductions that would mean the standardisation isn't necessary. With gearboxes and engines lasting more races (3 for engine & i think 10 for gearbox).

I think they need to have standard wheels, maybe a standard steering wheel, and perhaps a standard rear wing, and make tires have to last a whole race. Surely would reduce costs to an acceptable level and maybe even limiting the number of people each team can have at a race, say all engineers bar 2 or 3 have to be at the factory during the race, or even limit the number of staff a team can employ overall, including contractors and subsidiaries. Make it tight so staff can't work for both the F1 and road car or other race category teams within the season.

Or if they really wanted to cut costs, get rid of the travelling circus that is the motor homes/showrooms. I mean how many huge trailers & motor homes does a team need?

[d1 mule]

iv read somewhere the operating budget for F1 is in te region of $100m a season, and A1GP is approx $5m. now i cant see how them manage to soend the extra $95m, sure the cars are faster etc so a few million extra but 95, what a joke. its clearly too many cheifs not enough indians.

and control racing would kinda defiet the whole purpose of F1 wouldnt it??

[thornz]

iv read somewhere the operating budget for F1 is in te region of $100m a season, and A1GP is approx $5m. now i cant see how them manage to soend the extra $95m, sure the cars are faster etc so a few million extra but 95, what a joke. its clearly too many cheifs not enough indians.

and control racing would kinda defiet the whole purpose of F1 wouldnt it??

The main cost difference is due to all the development in the cars. The cars that start the season in Melbourne each year, are nothing like the car that starts the final Grand Prix of the year, hundreds of changes throughout the season. Then I also guess the other big difference, is that in F1 you actually have top drivers, and top drivers cost allot of money.

[fivebob]

iv read somewhere the operating budget for F1 is in te region of $100m a season, and A1GP is approx $5m. now i cant see how them manage to soend the extra $95m, sure the cars are faster etc so a few million extra but 95, what a joke. its clearly too many cheifs not enough indians.

$100m would be a mid field runner, like Renault or Red Bull, top runners like Ferrari & McLaren are probably in the region of $250m, with Toyota reportedly spending $400m.

The differences are not in the number of chiefs, but rather the number of indians. Typically a top level F1 team employees 500+ people to get the job done. They run their wind tunnel(s) 24hrs a day 7 days a week in 3 shifts. Their design and model making depts have to keep the supply of new parts flowing to the wind tunnel.

The FIA must shoulder some of the blame for this, because they keep changing the rules from year to year, forcing the teams to develop two cars at once, effectively doubling the staffing requirement. Actually it's probably more than doubling because quite often you need to design a new car virtually from scratch and that take a lot more effort than refining an existing design. Even a seeming simple change like the one to a single tyre supplier resulted in a complete redesign for all of the Michelin runners.

Effectively with the engine freeze the teams no longer spend so much on engine development or the current engine. Though contrary to what you might expect the budgets are probably not much lower, because they need to keep on developing for when the engine freeze is lifted or they will be behind the other teams.

and control racing would kinda defiet the whole purpose of F1 wouldnt it??

Exactly, that's why the manufacturers, which are more than half the field, would abandon it and start their own series.

[JustinSpiderholden]

End of the day if you can't afford to play don't try simple

[Rivit]

good quali by trulli, toyota p2, but most important, massa p1 with 2 between him and hamilton.. hope hamilton keeps his arrogant attitude and takes himself out trying to get past kimi on the first corner. go ferrari!

[Mr Revhead]

nah hamiltons got it wrapped up

[2jayzgte]

nah hamiltons got it wrapped up

I reckon as well as long as he keeps his head and uses Kovallianen as his protection he'll be the next World Champion he does'nt need to mix up at the front just stay ahead of the Debris behind him and its in the bag.

[Mr Revhead]

yeah pretty much

nice tidy first lap, then settle into a routine and its done
the pressure really is on massa, he HAS to win and hope hamilton has a shocker.
not to say theres no pressure on hamilton, but all he has to do is get to the end in 5th or better. and seeing as he's in one of the top 4 fastest cars, he should have too many issues doing that

[fivebob]

Looking at the difference between Q2 & Q3 times , Massa is probably very light on fuel, so is Trulli, Kimi could be have about 1 lap less than Hamilton. Provided Hamilton keeps his head and stays with Räikkönen, which shouldn't be hard if Trulli stays ahead at the start and holds him up, then he has a good chance of being second after the first round of stops.

Even if Räikkönen gets past Trulli, then as long as Hamilton keeps his head he should be third when Trulli pits.

Given the number of first corner accidents at Brazil in the past, Hamilton needs to keep his head while things settle down. It's his Championship to lose, Massa (and the race stewards) will not win it.

[thornz]

All I can say is,

BEST TITLE DECIDING RACE EVER!!!

Although I am a Ferrari fan, congrats to Lewis, luck was defintily on his side today.

[Rivit]

no comment

[2jayzgte]

All I can say is,

BEST TITLE DECIDING RACE EVER!!!

Although I am a Ferrari fan, congrats to Lewis, luck was defintily on his side today.

I agree it was heart in your mouth stuff if you were a Mclaren fan if Glock had got across the line in that last lap I reckon that would have broke Hamilton's heart for sure.Massa and Raikkonen did there jobs Ferrari took care of the constructors and almost stole the drivers.

I would have liked to see if Hamilton had have lost as to most Mclaren fans on this forum would have bought up the stewards or the FIA robbing Mclaren again.But good Hamilton he deserve's it he's been the most consistent driver all year.

[repowered]

what a crazy finish with the rain with 6 laps to go, Glocks looked almost like he slowed to let others and lewis pass??? did he spin or go off or somthing??? he stayed on the slicks aye?

[thornz]

what a crazy finish with the rain with 6 laps to go, Glocks looked almost like he slowed to let others and lewis pass??? did he spin or go off or somthing??? he stayed on the slicks aye?

Yeah, took the gamble to stay on slicks, almost payed off until it got to wet on the last lap, which in turn handed the title to Hamilton. Dont think he spun, he just couldnt get any grip.