Toyspeed.org.nz Message Board

by **soopachargen** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 8:58 pm

I bought a blacktop to replace the tired silvertop in my gt sedan and have been getting it ready to go into the car, today I was doing the cambelt and took the front covers off and it turns out that the belt tensioner is a manual spring one.
Does this mean that my blacktop is a blacktop head with silvertop block? Or is it a silvertop with blacktop covers and throttles and loom?? Or is it just some random blacktop that ended up with a manual tensioner for some unknown reason? It doesnt look like anything has been messed with or been apart, it all looks very factory, no orange goop anywhere or anything.

by **frost** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:07 pm

to use the spring type you have to use the silvertop oil pump,
so maybe it is a silvertop bottom, its not really a bad thing as the rods are better,

by **soopachargen** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:10 pm

it says in the FAQ that to use the silvertop oil pump you have to use a silvertop water pump, the cambelt kit i got from toyota was an ae111 kit, so would that suggest it was a blacktop water pump?

by **frost** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:25 pm

um ok im confused,
best way to tell is by the amount of teeth on the cam belt,
blacktop cam belt has 2 or 3 teeth more then silvertop, so they don't switch over between heads, so you need buy the belt kit for the head,

by **soopachargen** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:30 pm

the blacktop belt fits, its a bit tight if anything, its odd there are things that point toward blacktop and things that point toward silvertop

by **Mr Revhead** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:34 pm

bugger... i guess it's entirely possible someone wanted to do away with the auto-tensioner and swapped to the silvertop bits
or, its a silver top short block...
either way, I would doubt you will be able to feel the difference.
only real difference block wise is a fraction in weight of mass and compression.
easiest and cheapest way I can think to tell would be use an endoscope

I wouldn't worry about it really... unless you paid a premium for a blacktop

by **soopachargen** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 9:36 pm

Meh I paid 900 for it, I just hope that it hasnt done huge kms coz it would kind of defeat the purpose.

by **Adamal** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 10:26 pm

Are the ST and BT heads different? Search for a part number on it and see if you can find something on Google.

by **Bazda** » Thu Dec 10, 2009 11:43 pm

the VVT switch and the cam ex cam gaers are different between both.

The ST ex cam gear holes lots of holes in it so has lots of spokes, the BT looks like a hks cam gear having 3 spokes.

The ST vvt switch is quite rounded, the BT one looks more like an eletrical solenoid and its plastic with a metal housing holding it in place.

as for the tensioner, you can use the BT water pump with ST parts, but not vice versa.
And yes u will need the ST oil pump to run the manual tensioner.

There are other ways to tell but id be here all day and they are really small things like vacuum hose locations etc on the TBs

by **frost** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 12:55 am

soopachargen wrote:the blacktop belt fits, its a bit tight if anything, its odd there are things that point toward blacktop and things that point toward silvertop

if you can count the teeth on the old belt and compare it to the new one that would be the safest, as i think the silvertop belt being shorter can still fit. but i cant remember, its been ages since to make that mistake,

by **Mr Revhead** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 7:34 am

I think he suspects a bt head on a st block
so head differences won't really help him here....

by **soopachargen** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:24 pm

yeah it looks exactly like a blacktop, eg rocker covers and throttles, loom, ecu etc, but it has a manual tensioner. according to toyodiy the water pump is the same part for silver and blacktop

by **Bazda** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:32 pm

soopachargen wrote:yeah it looks exactly like a blacktop, eg rocker covers and throttles, loom, ecu etc, but it has a manual tensioner. according to toyodiy the water pump is the same part for silver and blacktop

Its not the same, the ST one has this little extra rib which blocks the BT hydrau tensioner from releasing all the way.
I have HEAPS of BT and ST water pumps along with oil pumps

by **Mr Revhead** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 3:35 pm

it's possible they superceded the st one to the same as a bt one and may show the same p/n on a catalouge

OMG so shiny! · by **Dell'Orto** » Fri Dec 11, 2009 6:49 pm

Yeah ST has been superceded to BT part number.

by **Flannelman** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:33 pm

just asking as where did the motor come from?

Start of the year i did a mate a deal and put a ST into a AE111 using all the blacktop intake/throttle bodies and exhaust. We even changed the rocker cover to complete the Blacktop look.
Anyway, he wound up crashing it and it was sold to a wrecker in New Plymouth. It might have been fixed as all it did was dump a wheel...

by **soopachargen** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 6:06 pm

i bought it up here (whangarei) off a mate who had pulled it out of a car

by **AE25** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 11:32 pm

you can run B/T cam pullies on ST head also even tho they're wider.
could you compare intake cam part number since they're supposedly different?
st has two brake booster lines, one each end of the throttles. B/T only one line on #1 throttle.
are the plenums interchangeable? i probly wouldnt intentify quads just by plenum type if thats the case

by **KwS** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 12:32 am

the thing is though, arent we talking about a ST block with BT head? in which case ALL the gear above the block would be BT, wouldnt it?

Is there no way to identify the block? no markings or anything?

by **KinLoud** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 5:47 am

hmmmm - good point, can you read the numbers stamped on the block?
The engine number is stamped on the block near where the bellhousing bolts on on the exhuast side of the engine.

Put that number into carjam or some other rego check website

OR

take that number to toyota and see when it was produced.

BUT

It won't tell you if you have silvertop or blacktop internals

Ken

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