aftermarket piggyback safc vs f con

[Lith]

I understand what you mean and believe you, but assuming that it only has a stock ECU + an S-AFC - while it may work (at least for providing a steady AFR) you have no idea what the timing is doing through the rev range, what part load is like etc etc. It is of no credit to the S-AFC that it works, so much as he's just fortunate that it all happened to work out ok for him!

[fivebob]

Motec is nice but 50% of the features are never needed. My EMS 6860 (big brother to the stinger) is only using about 60% of what it can do.

If you find an ECU that you can use 100% of then it's time for a new ECU.

That's the most common argument I hear against buying a MoTeC and quite frankly it's BS, with a large dose of ECU envy thrown in

FWIW I use about 60% of the features on my M800, and if you discount the ones that don't apply to my car like Drive by Wire, Cam Control, Gear Shift and all the functions for Rotors and uneven fire ignitions then I'd be using about 75% of the available functionality, more if I got off my arse and fitted the Traction control and water injection stuff I've got lying around

[Lith]

^ For sure, however a G4 Extreme would do the same...

[fivebob]

^ For sure, however a G4 Extreme would do the same...

The same as what?

[Lith]

Leave most people using at most 60-70% of its abilities to get what they need out of it

[fivebob]

Leave most people using at most 60-70% of its abilities to get what they need out of it

Exactly my point. On any reasonably capable ECU you will never use all the features available. So the argument that you only use nn% of the features of Brand X ECU, so you can use something of lesser functionality is BS.

Pity the G4 is about 8 years too late for me or I might have bought it... The again the New MoTeC M1 series is probably another 8-10 years ahead of the field

Old adage applies here... You pays your money and you takes your choice... The choice is up to the individual and I'm very happy with mine. If I was doing it again, I'd probably make the same choice... or maybe an M1 .

[Lith]

Yep makes sense, Motec were miles ahead and you got what you paid for - M1 is probably further ahead again but the difference is now you can pay far less and what you paid for way back when.... now when you are paying less for a Motec you get more than you need, which is kinda like having your cake and eating it too

Getting an S-AFC is like paying 1/4 of the price of something designed for the job, and getting something which slightly more advanced than putting a resistor in the AFM signal wire.

[steve murch]

well many years ago i tuned ohlsens vr4 power little mirage,i did that with a safc-2 and that managed low 10's before going to an autronic.
so it can be done and for many years and still even now the japs swear by piggy backed factory ecu's.
if you know what your doing and looking for it can be done.
and just to add some fuel here,motec is far from being the best ecu on the market,its very good but not top of the line.

[1598cc]

how did you tune the timing? retarding the CAS? ive had some time tuning safc's before and it worked ok. problem was i could get the WOT tuning pritty decent but off boost it wasnt so smooth as to be expected. its abit hit n miss, subtracting fuel on the safc to compensate for larger injectors, then just adjusting the base timing to the point id get detonation then pull it back a tad. still works tho.

[2jayzgte]

The things that sold me on the F-Con were Plug N Play for the Auto bonus the resolution or speed of the processor was another selling point vs say the others I looked at E-Manage Ultimate Apexi Power FC and the SAFC 2 in the end now I've got the car back humming I don't regret paying the money.

[MAGN1T]

You just squirt some water into it. That way rather than having to fight the over advanced timing, you make use of it.

Steve

[1598cc]

You just squirt some water into it. That way rather than having to fight the over advanced timing, you make use of it.

Steve

ah yes didnt think of that at all, will have to give it ago next build.

[QikStarlie]

long as it not over advanced. you want the least timing that achieves best power. not over advanced and band aid fixed.
but yeh can be a win, but not in all situations

[JustinSpiderholden]

http://www.mclarenelectronics.com/Produ ... nits&id=87

Wouldnt that be pretty much the best?

[iOnic]

I'm not sure there is any such thing as a "best" ECU. It's all in the tune and application - for some people a cheap MAPECU can be the "best" ECU for the job...for others it has to be an F CON V Pro....

I'm a strong believer in the factory ECU's ability to run the engine under every possible condition, adapt to changes and modify it's tune to suit and to protect the engine at all costs. I think this is why the Japs swear by piggybacks so much - the manufacturer really does know best in this case.

Aftermarket ECU's regardless of how many pages the feature list is, do not have this adaptability. You can tune it for a certain range of conditions but at the end of the day even a boost increase will render the entire tune useless.

Quite interested in the world of re-flashing of stock ECU's that Mitsi guys are doing - wish it was possible on Toyotas

[QikStarlie]

but soon as you mess with the signals the ecu receives. there goes all your fail safes

[steve murch]

no offence meant to anyone one here but if you don't know how to tune or what your looking for in regards to any gains you'll make any ecu look bad and run a very high risk of engine damage,tuning is a art form and very hard to teach Ive tried many times to show others without success

[Py7h0n]

I agree Steve. If you can tune properly you can do it with almost any tool. If you can't tune --- Things can go very wrong, very quickly.

As shown by my mates dyno sheet below:

SAFC Tuned MK4 Supra