shitty way to lose a young life,

[Mr Revhead]

there is no "it's all about hp" suggestion.

[tsoob]

Way too many factors involved to say that....

You mean, just like the 'it's all about hp' suggestion?

guys how can you honestly think that power restrictions wont help..?

[sergei]

Way too many factors involved to say that....

You mean, just like the 'it's all about hp' suggestion?

guys how can you honestly think that power restrictions wont help..?

Nope, I seen muppets doing stupid shit in 60hp datsuns.

[sergei]

Actually come to think about it: muppets will still be doing stupid shit even if they can't get licence. The only advantage if the licensing is adjusted as such as these muppets can't get it, is that these muppets can be easily picked up by cops, unlike now, if stopped at check point they will continue because they have licence.

[tsoob]

Way too many factors involved to say that....

You mean, just like the 'it's all about hp' suggestion?

guys how can you honestly think that power restrictions wont help..?

Nope, I seen muppets doing stupid sh*t in 60hp datsuns.

yeah so have i.

come back to the question tho

how can you honestly think that restricting the power wont help to reduce these types of thing?

[cat007]

Way too many factors involved to say that....

You mean, just like the 'it's all about hp' suggestion?

guys how can you honestly think that power restrictions wont help..?

It MAY help, but that's not my point.

My point is, if you have a car with 100hp, but it only weighs 500kg, it's going to be rather quick.

There's no realistic way to police such matters unless you have a standard car (1990 fwd auto 1.6 corolla for example) and it's not allowed to be modified until you're a certain age AND have passed certain tests etc etc. and EVERYONE has to have that particular type of car, just in a different colour.

It's just too hard to police/control anything different.

You could list, quite literally, every single component in a car and say 'this needs to be a controlled item because it could affect.....'

[Bling]

If young people have to learn to drive it less powerful cars I think they will have a better idea of car control.

I think power has a lot of affect on how some people drive. If I had a turbo car I would find it hard to not boost everywhere. Hence I drive a levin If all cars were just as easy to control as each other power wouldn't come into it. But its pretty obvious the more power you have the faster you can potentially get into a bad situation. So then you add inexperienced drivers to the mix and what do you get? Accidents.

Which cars out there are 500kg with 100hp cat007?

[79rolla]

i learn to drive im my ke30 with a 4k, (and i still do drive it) my dad would not let me do a powerful conversion on it until i got my full, glad he made me wait, i can do stupid things in it, but its just that much harder to get myself in bad situations because of it being underpowered, the first time i drove my brothers car to town (wide-track bluebird) with skinny tiers in the rain i spun out and hit a bank, because i thought it would hold the road as well as my car, and i planted my foot in the strait b4 the corner.. i got my car a bit sideways after hitting stones, dirt on the road, if it had more power it would have spat out sideways i i would've been in the shit..

i believe hp restrictions would help, Muppet's will always find ways to be Muppet's, but less power means one the more determined Muppet's will do stupid shit. and if nothing else you will be more mature by the time you can get a powerful car reducing the number of idiots in them, and hopefully they can learn how to control a car first

if that makes any cence

[tsoob]

i learn to drive im my ke30 with a 4k, (and i still do drive it) my dad would not let me do a powerful conversion on it until i got my full, glad he made me wait, i can do stupid things in it, but its just that much harder to get myself in bad situations because of it being underpowered, the first time i drove my brothers car to town (wide-track bluebird) with skinny tiers in the rain i spun out and hit a bank, because i thought it would hold the road as well as my car, and i planted my foot in the strait b4 the corner.. i got my car a bit sideways after hitting stones, dirt on the road, if it had more power it would have spat out sideways i i would've been in the sh*t..

i believe hp restrictions would help, Muppet's will always find ways to be Muppet's, but less power means one the more determined Muppet's will do stupid sh*t. and if nothing else you will be more mature by the time you can get a powerful car reducing the number of idiots in them, and hopefully they can learn how to control a car first

if that makes any cence

exactally my point.

[duddley]

How come drivers holding a restricted licence aren't required to have a restricted plate in the rear window simliar to how learner drivers are required to have L plates, this would make policing the licencing system a whole lot easier. Also power to weight ratios should be enforced ie no more then then 10hp per 100kg

[pc]

I don't think power restrictions will help because of the following:
- muppets will be muppets, doesn't matter what they drive, they will be dangerous
- people care less about cheap s#ity cars as stated earlier in this tthread, power restrictions may have opposite of intended effect.
- learn to drive an under powered car with your foot flat then "upgrade" and same problem exists.

Power restrictions sound good in theory, but I don't think reflect reality. It will place restrictions on many other well educated careful drivers though.

As said earlier this particular incident was in an low powered rear drive auto, so the power argument isn't relevant, yet the outcome is the same. Rear drive may be more of a factor.

[MR2SIK]

I still managed to write off a 1.2L Vauxhall Viva when I was 17, Dont know what kinda power it had, but when I tried timing a 0-100km/h run, I got bored and put down the watch before I got there
If you're gonna be a muppet behind the wheel, it doesnt matter if you have 50 or 500hp, shits gonna get $&#$% up. I was just lucky that I was out in the wop wops when I did it so there was noone around to hit.

[Mr Revhead]

That is true.

It is also true that there is a much greater risk of a bigger accident with a tonne of power.

[Dell'Orto]

Yeah, pretty hard to wheelspin for 100m with 60hp, even in the wet.

[Elmo]

I As said earlier this particular incident was in an low powered rear drive auto, so the power argument isn't relevant, yet the outcome is the same. Rear drive may be more of a factor.

Excuse me? 140 is NOT a low powered car. Sure, its not a turbo or anything like that, but it is a performance car. Corrollas etc are low powered cars.

If 140 hp is low powered, what do you call a 55 hp car? (and thats with a higher cc than spec, a high lift cam, big valves and bigger twin throat carb)

Yes, muppets will always be muppets, but as in a previous post, less horse power = less speed over a given distance

[tsoob]

I don't think power restrictions will help because of the following:
- muppets will be muppets, doesn't matter what they drive, they will be dangerous
- people care less about cheap s#ity cars as stated earlier in this tthread, power restrictions may have opposite of intended effect.
- learn to drive an under powered car with your foot flat then "upgrade" and same problem exists.

Power restrictions sound good in theory, but I don't think reflect reality. It will place restrictions on many other well educated careful drivers though.

As said earlier this particular incident was in an low powered rear drive auto, so the power argument isn't relevant, yet the outcome is the same. Rear drive may be more of a factor.

i dont know how to cut this up nice and pretty like some other guys do but


Muppets will be muppets..
you are right, however a muppet in a less powerfull car cant possibly do as much dammage as one in with more power, the physical limitations of what the car can do are simply less.

people care lesss about shitty cars etc...
well most of the "muppets" that you are refering to are usually "into" their cars and do care to some extent about their cars. there is no real justification to saying that would have the oppisite effect.

Think about it, the point is to slow them down, the car is slower already so its harder to make as much mess. also if they do get to those faster speeds it shows more intent/disregard for the laws/safety

the point of learning to drive in a lower powered car means that they have some more experience behind the wheel before they can legally get behind the wheel of a high powered car. (vs stragiht into a powerfull car with zero experience) again how is this a bad idea???

the reality is that power restrictions MAY dissadvanatage a few carefull drivers (there are some around) BUT it would surely be a small price to pay for someones life.

There is no substiute for experience on the road, NZ dosnet have a decent licencing system or training programme for its drivers, so this would be a logical step in reducing some of these type of problems.

[S T E A L T H]

Way too many factors involved to say that....

You mean, just like the 'it's all about hp' suggestion?

guys how can you honestly think that power restrictions wont help..?

Is there any evidence to say that they would? ie overrepresentation of high-performance cars in crash statistics for drivers under 20 years old?

Improving training would certainly help. They can start by bringing Prodrive back and allocating sufficient funding to make it compulsory.

Drove the aforementioned V8 ute home today again. Looked closely at the tyres - "Triangle" brand. Almost new, silly tread pattern. Car got a VTNZ wof 2 weeks ago. I'd class it in the top 1% of dangerous cars on NZ roads today.

[frost]

triangle are the worst ever!! id soon be driving on fully worn out GT radials then those POS. and i hate GT radials.

[pc]

I As said earlier this particular incident was in an low powered rear drive auto, so the power argument isn't relevant, yet the outcome is the same. Rear drive may be more of a factor.

Excuse me? 140 is NOT a low powered car. Sure, its not a turbo or anything like that, but it is a performance car. Corrollas etc are low powered cars.
If 140 hp is low powered, what do you call a 55 hp car? (and thats with a higher cc than spec, a high lift cam, big valves and bigger twin throat carb)

In a 1270KG car that gives about the same power to weight as an older 1600 corolla... but corollas are low powered?
How would one find a newish 55hp car these days?

High powered cars certainly get to higher speeds quicker... but how many crashes are directly related to how quickly someone got to the speed they started to loose control?
Where are the statistics to indicate that the power of a car has any real bearing on whether an accident would have happened or not?

the reality is that power restrictions MAY dissadvanatage a few carefull drivers (there are some around) BUT it would surely be a small price to pay for someones life.

I'm not aware any statistics that would back up that dramatic statement... but people love the idea that changing a rule will save lives.

[Elmo]

I think this latest crash shows that how quickly a car got to speed played in the out come. A lesser powered car could not have reached the speed he did before crashing. No one can say he wasnt going fast, the damage to fence and distance covered screams speed.

Pc, your saying that 1270 / 140 is equivilant to a 1600 corrolla?


To all those people that say a lower powered car wont save lives, be realistic, go get something like an old viva, go out and thrash that, then go thrash a sylvia, you tell me which one was easier to control. Anyone that says the sylvia is a muppet, yes, it does have better technology and supension etc, but the point is, stomp on the gas and see what one looses traction first! Yes, you can drift a viva, but you are much less likely to loose control on a straight piece of road after pulling out from a side street taking out a decent part of a brick fence. You are much less likely to get to the speed it takes to rip a car in half while wrapping itself round a tree killing most of its ocupants (like what happened in hastings a few years back) on a suburban street like that.