4age blacktop turbo

[jacobrjett]

ive seen this before on trademe, its been sitting there for a while... but ive been getting more tempted...

http://www.trademe.co.nz/motors/car-parts-accessories/performance/turbos/auction-491971507.htm

I have googled enough to know that I would like to ask here for more direct opinions rather then all the dribble ive found on the internet.

I have a freshly rebuilt 4age blacktop with 1000kms. Unfortunately I did not replace with gze pistons. Its just oem parts, except I am running silvertop conrods and 4agze crank (not that the crank makes a difference).

I would like to boost around 8 psi and run 98 octane.
I understand that an aftermarket ECU would be optimal but I would like to keep the standard ECU for a while. I dont need the engine to last another 200,000 kms or anything, but I would like it to go for a few years. If it does blow, I would just buy a 2nd hand 4age, swap it over and then keep the blown and rebuild it for a project. I am intending to replace the 2-1 section on the standard exhaust, and delete the catalytic converter for a test pipe for better flow.

I am new to turbos: never owned or worked on one. But I pick up on things pretty quick so I should be able to install it myself.

My questions are;

*I am guessing that I will need to buy a new turbo for that kit. Can anyone recommend a good small turbo that will spool quick and suit my low boost application?
*If my engine were to blow from the high compression, exactly what damage would it be? a blown head gasket?
*would I be safe to assume a 30% power increase using standard ecu, injectors etc. just everything in the kit and the new turbo?
*anything else someone would like to add?
*how long do you think it would last, or should I just not bother?
*does the kit look dodgy or is it missing anything?

I thank you in advance and really appreciate any input.

Also if anyone knows who owns that kit and if they are here on toyspeed, I wouldnt mind their username.

decided not to go through with this guys thanks for all ur info

[d1 mule]

there is 0 point doing this conversion without at the very least some sort of fuel controller. For the money get a Link Atom.

that being said running standard comp ratio is far less than ideal...

[jacobrjett]

there is 0 point doing this conversion without at the very least some sort of fuel controller. For the money get a Link Atom.

so it wouldnt perform well at all? the standard ECU would have been a temporary thing, i was wondering if it would be "good enough" for a while, or if I will be able to drive it for a while like it is - if im going to have to save up another wad of money for the ECU at the same time I probably wont bother lol

that being said running standard comp ratio is far less than ideal...

enough people say that I will back off completely - im aware I should have planned for this conversion when doing the rebuild, but I didnt. I am just trying to find out opinions on the high comp+ boost

[Dell'Orto]

Without a decent ECU, you'll blow it to bits in no time. There was a chap on here a few years back who did turbo an internally stock silvertop, TD04 and Link from memory and made 130kw on 5 or 6psi.
I dont know if the blacktop ECU will even run with positive pressure

[jacobrjett]

Without a decent ECU, you'll blow it to bits in no time. There was a chap on here a few years back who did turbo an internally stock silvertop, TD04 and Link from memory and made 130kw on 5 or 6psi.
I dont know if the blacktop ECU will even run with positive pressure

hmm. thats a bit dissapointing.

I guess ill just wait until I can get a proper turbo setup, no biggie

[gt4dude]

not recommending this, but you may be able to strike a combination of map sensor and injectors that will give you the fuelling you need,

with a simple fuel controller to dial back the low range and a wideband gauge kit so you can see whats going on you may be able to run a couple pounds

in the US celica community there is something known as a "magic triangle" where a 5sfe engined car can be fitted with a 3sgte turbo, map sensor and injectors and run on the original 5sfe ecu. the setup gives very usable afr's IIRC around 12.5-13:1 and usually a water/meth injection kit is used to deal with heat and knock

[Mr Revhead]

Sounds like you need to spend the best part of a decent ECU to trick it into running

[sergei]

The fueling is only part of equation, the NA ignition map is totally different to boosted map. When you have boost (be that only 0.5bar) and you pushing advance as if it was NA, it will destroy the engine (even if you dump a lot of fuel in).

[QikStarlie]

low boost & high compression will work good. just dont expect to run a lot of boost and make big power. but it will be nice and responsive and make good power, for the small amount of boost you run. i wouldn't run a small turbo, go for something a little larger that doesn't come on so early. as boost at low rpm with high compression will promote knock. keeping the compression high it wont be lazy off boost

i was running a little more compression on my smallport turbo 11.5:1 with gt2876r. ran about 11psi max. i used boost controler to ramp the boost on through the rpm, getting more aggressive after peak torque where its less likely to knock. had smooth progressive power delivery. and a heap to top end power. almost didn't feel like a turbo car at all.

[Shrike]

another option is a ms3 about 1.2k with everything already assembled you just need to wire it (can help with) and then either tune it yourself or get someone to (there are a few people around that can but most shops like stm shred wont touch them. and some bigger injectors as long as you dont get knock you should be fine

[gt4dude]

98 Celica SR (ST)

315CC Sup Injectors
FPR
small FMIC
Walbro pump
Garrett T25 Turbo
2.5 inch exhaust system
Stage 3 clutch

First dyno with MBC and SAFC 2



Second Dyno with Greddy ProfecB Spec 2 and AEM FIC (no timing adjustment)


Soon Ford 440CC injectors and bigger FMIC. Timing now adjusted but no dyno yet.

155WHP aint bad for an engine that makes 120 flywheel HP stock. But as again, I'm not telling you to go ahead and do this, you ask if its possible heres some proof

[dnalunchie]

Isn't turboing stock black top rods about as sensible as raising the boost on a gtt with a boost tap?

[Lloyd]

"But going by the second graph you're making less power now..."

So logically it'll be slower

[QikStarlie]

Isn't turboing stock black top rods about as sensible as raising the boost on a gtt with a boost tap?

I am running silvertop conrods

trying to turbo it on factory ecu would be though

[jacobrjett]

yea im just gonna wait until my next car before i look at boost now

this only my 2nd car so i suppose its not too bad i dont have a boost yet haha

[AE86less]

F*ck your avatar disturbs me.

[dnalunchie]

yea im just gonna wait until my next car before i look at boost now

this only my 2nd car so i suppose its not too bad i dont have a boost yet haha

be careful of boost, once you have it, you cant go back

[tsoob]

I have a link for sale, $1500 cash, will do everything you need.

[tim_blair]

it really depends on what you want to do and how much money you have,

if you want a turbo blacktop which by the way would be awesome then you will need an ecu i would go with link and also you are going to need all the hardware as well intercooler, manifolds, piping, etc etc and all the countless hours of modifing all the off the shelf parts that you buy to actuall fit,
which as we all now none of them ever do.

from reading through that auction you susgested it looks like most of the hard work in terms of the modifing and building work is done for you altho the turbo is nacked, but you would probibly want to get your own turbo to suit your build anyway, and its a reasonable price if you were to price up all those parts seperatly you would pay waaay more and still have to get it all to fit.

your still gona have to buy an ecu any way or run it on like 2 psi (the black top has a factory 4psi boost defender built in)

not to mention injectors (black tops use side feed) and a pump and pistons just to name a few.
so if thats waht you want to do and you have the budget then go for it, just do your research first

[soopachargen]

isn't that your auction tim_blair?