intercooler too big?

[wanado13's]

I've been told that on a supercharged car that if the cooler is too big then the superchager will have throttle lag (that i knew), but does the superchager keep boosting for a second or two once your foot is off the throttle beacause the supercharger uses all the cooled air stored in the intercooler. I have a rather large one for my car but ive just been told this and if this is the case then it'l be way to dangerous to do

[Monsterbishi]

I've been told that on a supercharged car that if the cooler is too big then the superchager will have throttle lag (that i knew), but does the superchager keep boosting for a second or two once your foot is off the throttle beacause the supercharger uses all the cooled air stored in the intercooler. I have a rather large one for my car but ive just been told this and if this is the case then it'l be way to dangerous to do

Does it anyway to an extent on the stock cooler, it's the joy of having everything post throttle body. It's something you get used to.

[FLAWLES]

u have to sacrifise something for the other
just run a front mount and a biger crank pulley 4agte has done it on his 4agze

[mike simmonds]

the only reason ull get bad throttle response is because the TB is b4 the supercharger all that piping and the big cooler. if u dnt want bad throttle response and it 'boosting for 2-3 sec' after ur foots off the gas then move ur TB close to the inlet (after intercooler) and it will run fine.

[wanado13's]

TB? you know i don't know much mike wots a TB? Is that a diffulcult thing to do? it already has the pulley kit. is it worth it performance wise, i know it'll look phat but ron at total told me a smaller more efficient one would give more power......

[mike simmonds]

TB = throttle body, its piss easy to do. the hybrid cooler u got is real gud! awsum flow etc, itl will just take a bit to build up pressure behind it, once ur on boost it will work well.

[EVLGTZ]

TB? you know i don't know much mike wots a TB? Is that a diffulcult thing to do? it already has the pulley kit. is it worth it performance wise, i know it'll look phat but ron at total told me a smaller more efficient one would give more power......

TB = throttlebody

[wanado13's]

sweet i'll ask ron bout it an see what it'll cost. oh and mike where are you putting the cooler?air con out and up in there below the lights. have you mounted yours yet? any chance of you sending a digi photo so i can see?

[matt dunn]

the only reason ull get bad throttle response is because the TB is b4 the supercharger all that piping and the big cooler. if u dnt want bad throttle response and it 'boosting for 2-3 sec' after ur foots off the gas then move ur TB close to the inlet (after intercooler) and it will run fine.

Cant do that. It wont work.
You are suggesting to move the Throttle body to after the intercooler?
The TB must be before the supercharger and so that will mean that the S/C has to suck the air from the cooler and then there is nothing to cool it down once it is compressed.

Matt

[gdsup]

yes you can run s/c like that, requires blow off valve tho, air filter-> supercharger-> intercooler and blowoff valve -> throttle body-> inlet manifold-> ports.
to many people talk about what they dont know on forums, please people think before you misslead

[matt dunn]

yes you can run s/c like that, requires blow off valve tho, air filter-> supercharger-> intercooler and blowoff valve -> throttle body-> inlet manifold-> ports.
to many people talk about what they dont know on forums, please people think before you misslead

Have you actually done this?

It will not work!

to many people talk about what they dont know on forums, please people think before you misslead

Speak for your self !

A supercharger is mechaniclly driven and has no control over the out put pressure.
You have to control it by varying the amount of air that you let into it.
Running the intake open into the air will cause it to draw in massive amounts of air and cause a huge output flow.
You were obviuosly planning to use a blow off valve to release the pressure when the the throttle closes but do you realise how much a s/c flows when the engine is at 7000rpm? No blow off valve will be able to flow that much, and compressing all that air only to vent it off for no gain will suck massive amounts of power.

I still believe it will not work.

Matt

[BBBrad]

If u have a look at a "some" aftermarket eaton sc setups they have the throttle after the sc, (just a normal tb setup motor). The eaton sc that is used has a pressure bypass valve built into the back of the unit that opens and just recycles the air while the throttle is closed. Also when talking centrifugal type sc setups 90% have the throttle in the normal position and a bov has been added.
Back in the day I heavily modded my sc mr2. First I had a very big intercooler and realised that throttle response was very slow and was a pain to drive, so I then moved the throttle to after the sc/intercooler and added a bov. Throttle response was now the oppisite and was crazy to drive ( made the meanest sounds etc.) After all that I wanted more power and seen the light and converted it to turbo.
There is some info around the net that describes this sort of setup. Dont try and do it without some kind of pressure release. I have heard of nasty things like throttle plates bending and throttle shafts snapping due to the high pressure during closed throttle positions.

[Crampy]

Actually Matt Dunn, the supercharger is a positive displacement compressor. It will only draw as much air as is allowed by the engines revs and the the pulley ratio between the crank and s/c. The throttle body can be after the s/c and intercooler. It would draw max air for the given revs of the engine. You would definitely need a blow of valve, because the air will still flow the s/c but not through the TB when closed. The blow off valve would release the pressure and stop the possiblility of blowing pipes off.
IT HAS BEEN DONE AND PROVEN, ACTUALLY!!! It gave very good throttle response, but the blow off valve is a bit insane as it vents air for a long time as the superchager will continue to spin and compress air. Depends if you like that sound, or you could get a quiet BOV, or even a plumb back valve (which would probably be best).
gdsup does know what he's saying, he gave a good sequence of how the setup could be done.

My 2 cents worth.

[wanado13's]

sweet thanx for the info, but how hard is it to put the tb after the superchager and all that it involves? and would it be worth all the extra cost to do it or am i likely to get all the same power outa a smaller cooler? anyone know of any shops in welly area that do that at a reasonable price?

[~SlideWays~]

If you front mount it most of the compressed air the engine sucks in is from the extra piping that you have. So even if you have a smaller cooler it will still have all the piping compared to the standard top mount which has $&#$% all piping.

I have done the whole front mount thing on my car and it was a pain in the arse at first. Because when i take my foot off the pedal it revs 1.5second (estimate), it is pretty easy to get used to...just change the timing of when you depress the clutch pedal and lift of the throttle.

Its really funny when other ppl try to drive my car and it sounds like they dont know how to change gear properly i.e 1st gear, change, vroooom, 2nd gear, change, vroooom, 3rd gear, change, vroooom hahaha

[FLAWLES]

this whole s/c be4 the t/b will work
but i really dont see what gains this will give and it would be a whole lot of piss arseing around for jack
espeacialy on a ae92 or ae101 as u have oiis all room anyway to do this

just run a 300 by 400 or 450 front mount with a biger pulley there we go prob sloved
this will work

[Monsterbishi]

this whole s/c be4 the t/b will work
but i really dont see what gains this will give and it would be a whole lot of piss arseing around for jack :?
espeacialy on a ae92 or ae101 as u have oiis all room anyway to do this :cry:

just run a 300 by 400 or 450 front mount with a biger pulley there we go prob sloved :lol:
this will work :twisted:

The benefit of the TB post SC is that throttle control is nice and quick, like the NA 4AGE, on our chargers, you can blip the gas pedal, and it won't come straight down, just because of the huge volume of air that is already after the TB butterfly.

[IH8TEC]

is there any power to be made from it, if so how much? roughly,

[CozmoNz]

get a plumback bov, hook the relase up to the bottom of the bumper in front of each tire (get something that splits the compressed air), so when your driving on water, it splits it ^_^, and would look BLOODY awsome it blowing all the water etc around your tires away


baha, just an idea, depends on how much boost ur pushing though

[gdsup]

should give no real performance gains, unless you upgrade to a larger TB at the same time, the advantage for me will be more wieght shift on lift off, which may or may not help in control for skiding

and matt dunn have you actually done this??? and found that it wont/doesnt work, i have seen it done 1st hand and that is why my car is now set up to run this, with the factory ecu the s/c will stay engaged for 5~ seconds, and make long gushing sounds, but im not worried about this, there are other methods to switch the s/c clutch but toyota designed it this way to avoid excessive clutch wear

[/quote]and compressing all that air only to vent it off for no gain will suck massive amounts of power.
[/quote]

and how the hell can you be compressing air if your venting it straight to atmoshere??? hence with no pressure to compress how the hell will it drain so much power???, and why are you worried about power drain on lift off ???

but hey thanks for sharing your concerns lil buddy