1s to 3s swap

[Pies]

does the 1s engine use the same mounts as a 3s? im lookin at swapping the 1s in my project, with a 3s. and want to know if the 3s will bolt into the exsisting mounts.

also, does the 1s and 3s have the same gearbox mounting pattern? eg... will 1s gearbox bolt onto a 3s?

cheers

[Santa'sBoostinSleigh]

at a guess the 1s box will be desomated by a 3s motor if it does bolt up
i mean the 1s's are powerhouses, but sheesh!

[Pies]

hey, if toyota thought the 1s was grunty enough to be hooked up to a W55 then id say it must be a powerhouse

[deaf_rattle]

w55 will handle 3sgte
i think there is info at www.fasterthanjesus.net

[Pies]

cheers deaf_rattle. forgot about malcoms site

[RomanV]

Kinloud and Karl Skewes have basically done what you're looking to do, and as you know I'm doing more or less the same.

It isnt quite as straight foward as youd imagine though.

This is what I've found out so far:
(From Kinloud, Celica RA45, Karl Skewes, a few other people, and trawling various forums for information)


You need an EFI tank (Assuming 1S is carby?) and fuel pump.

The end of the 1S crank sticks out about 10mm further from the block than the 3S, so your flywheel and clutch etc are going to be in the wrong place. You need to get 5-10mm shaved off the bellhousing to make it work.

Your distributor will hit into the firewall, you either need to run a distributorless system, bash the wall, or cut it and make a box for it.

Your intake manifold on the 3SGE wraps over top of the head, and wont fit under the bonnet. You'll have to either make a new manifold, or chop your existing one to fit somehow. Also the throttle body faces the wrong way.

Also, 3SGEs dont like being stood upright, as they use gravity to feed the oil back from the head to the sump. They are leaned over about 30 degrees in transverse setups.
You either need to make an oil drain back from the head to the sump, or run an accusump system. This is what kinloud runs, and is quite a clever idea. (Google it if you want to know what it is)

You'll have to get an exhaust manifold fabricated, there's no factory bolt on solution.

You can run the 1S or 2S sump on the 3S block, which is designed for running upright. You may need the oil pump and some other bits from the 1S though, I cant remember.

You may need to swap the alternator from one side to the other for space considerations, you can use either a celica or MR2 alternator bracket to do this.

I think that 1S and 2S mounts fit straight onto the early 3S's, but Ken was saying that he thinks my gen 4 engine has different mounting holes than his gen 3. You'll have to see for yourself I suppose.

Also, I dunno how well a T50 box would take a beating from a 3S, you might want to get a W series box, but it's all $$$$.

[Dell'Orto]

hey, if toyota thought the 1s was grunty enough to be hooked up to a W55

Dont think there is any concern with smashing T50's

[RomanV]

Yeah, does your corona have a W box or T?

W box will last forever with a 3S.

[Santa'sBoostinSleigh]

sorry my initial thought was FWD like my poos corona
rwd is a whole different story
please continue to ignore me

[spencer]

Getting the efi tank is more of a luxury item. Its been done many a time with an external pump just dont run your tank to low or run a surge tank. other wise top notch info, seen kinlouds setup on the garage floor the other day its very nice!

[Pies]

you da man roman!

and yes... i have a w55. none of this t50 shite

[SUBARUCONVERT]

sorry my initial thought was FWD like my poos corona
rwd is a whole different story
please continue to ignore me

Yeha im 3S'in a "poos corona", nanny sleeper

[Pies]

sorry my initial thought was FWD like my poos corona
rwd is a whole different story
please continue to ignore me

Yeha im 3S'in a "poos corona", nanny sleeper

OMG MOST HELPFUL POST OF THE YEAR!!!!

[SUBARUCONVERT]

im glad u found it helpful

[Pies]

im glad u found it helpful

smart ass punk. im gonna smash you! rawr! your just lucky this keyboard is holding me back!

[SUBARUCONVERT]

does anyone know if the FWD 1C bellhousings are the same as FWD/4WD 3s bellhousings?

[KinLoud]

Same bolt pattern.
May have to shave it so clutch works

Ken
Ham
021 408 863

[3SGEMAD]

btw, you can stand the gen3 and gen4 3sge upright if you want, they have a secondary oil drain on the back of the head. Im sure you guys have seen my dads car with carbs on it!
have alook at it at taupo 11th dec, im taking it to the playday.

[KinLoud]

Gen3 3sge doesn't have drain on back of head.... I'm using gen3 3sge in my racecar and I have added an accusump (google this) and modified the factory sump and pickup.
Only gen4's (single or dual vvt) have this extra drain dammit!

Ken
Ham
021 408 863

[RomanV]

btw, you can stand the gen3 and gen4 3sge upright if you want, they have a secondary oil drain on the back of the head.

Yeah, that rear oil drain is a bit different to the rear wheel drive one on the Altezza however! (which is designed to be stood up)

The altezza engine has the oil drain down lower in the head, but it leads to the same part of the sump.

I'm going to machine a hole in the back of the head on mine, to run the standard altezza rear water outlet at the lower position, which has the oil feedback built in.

I'll just plug the top hole.

sure you guys have seen my dads car with carbs on it!
have alook at it at taupo 11th dec, im taking it to the playday.

What sort of car?
What sort of 3S?
What sort of mods?
How much power being made?
Dyno plot?

Same bolt pattern.
May have to shave it so clutch works

Ken
Ham
021 408 863

Yeah, regarding this whole shaving the bellhousing thing....
I thought it was because the end of the 1S crank stuck further out, offsetting the clutch...
However I've just been pulling apart a 1S powered cresta yesterday, and the thickness of the flywheel... It's friggen massive!
My 3S one would be half the thickness, I think that this is why the bellhousing is too long when running a 3S and 3S clutch/flywheel/etc...

Personally, I'd just go get a FWD 3SGE gearbox! They're not exactly hard to find, or expensive for that matter.