Formula 1 2009

[Jdawg]

My point was many people, not just on this forum as I was arguing this elsewhere just before my post, infer it is Max making these rule changes without consultation. I do not consider the Council to be a bunch of yes men to whatever Max says, especially when you see some of the names on that list.
Yes, there are political factions, like the one that ousted Jean Marie Balestre, which included Max.

[Mr Revhead]

The FIA believed it was acting with the full support of the teams when it introduced a new 'winner-takes-all' points system ahead the new Formula 1 season, according to its president Max Mosley.

sometimes it really does seem like the FIA is on another planet

[Jdawg]

Maybe trying to distract attn from the diffuser issue, which they have generously left up to the scrutineers at Melbourne to deal with

[2jayzgte]

Is'nt there like 3 teams involved with this deffuser issue I think Toyota BMW and one other???Interesting to see if anything comes of it.

I was reading a good article that Jackie Stewart wrote he reckon's the championship favourites are Massa and Hamilton surprise surprise..

[Mr Revhead]

brawn i think maybe the other one
all donw to interpritation of the rules....
sux ther FIA hasnt firmed it up a bit seeing as several ppl have asked for clarification.
maybe they are hopuing for more scandal and drama

in other news brendon hartleys superlicence application delayed

[JustinSpiderholden]

The defusser Issue seems rather pointless to me

Toyota, Williams and Brawn, have come up with somthing clever that is infact well 2within the regulations

As the other teams did not have this same brianwave theya re having a cry

Seems a we bit unfair and pointless to me but hey that's F1

Yeah apparntly Hartley has not meet all the requirements yet

[rolla_fxgt]

Yeah apparntly Hartley has not meet all the requirements yet

I thought he did like 3x the k's required for it, and had already ticked the other boxes, wonder what it is holding him up?

[JustinSpiderholden]

F1 makes me laugh

Its meant to be the pinical of desgin

So when someone else degsins somthing better than you did you complain

I really hope that Toyota, Williams and Brawn defusers are allowed to stay

[Jdawg]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.
McLaren, Ferrari, Renault and BMW Sauber follow this rule strictly and the rear crash structure ( the bit with the blinking red light) is seperate and above the diffuser
The designs of Brawn, Toyota and Williams the the diffuser blends onto the rear crash structure making it an extension of the rear diffusers upper panel raising and extending it.
Hence the disagreement.

The other teams want a ruling yes or no on the issue. If allowed they will make the necessary changes next race

So, on the weekend, look fot the cars taillight just below is the area of contention

[JustinSpiderholden]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.
McLaren, Ferrari, Renault and BMW Sauber follow this rule strictly and the rear crash structure ( the bit with the blinking red light) is seperate and above the diffuser
The designs of Brawn, Toyota and Williams the the diffuser blends onto the rear crash structure making it an extension of the rear diffusers upper panel raising and extending it.
Hence the disagreement.

The other teams want a ruling yes or no on the issue. If allowed they will make the necessary changes next race

So, on the weekend, look fot the cars taillight just below is the area of contention

Brawn, Williams and Toyota have not broken the rules in IMO

They were jsut smart enought to read the rules they have also followed it strictly what they hvae done is not illegal according to the rules

"Toyota's diffuser makes a very interesting interpretation of the revised 2009 rules (and one that has already prompted speculation regarding its legality). By exploiting regulations that allow extra bodywork within a 150mm zone in the centre of the car, the team appear to have cleverly shaped the TF109's rear crash structure so that it effectively lengthens and heightens the diffuser's central section, which also features a very low splitter at its base "

"Like engine suppliers Toyota's, Williams' interpretation of the revised diffuser regulations is highly innovative. Much of the diffuser's central section is actually lower than the outer sections. However, clever shaping of the rear crash structure immediately below the rear light effectively creates a second central section . In combination, the result is a central section that exceeds the 175mm height allowance that applies to the diffuser alone."

"McLaren, Ferrari, Renault and BMW Sauber have all made very literal interpretations of the revised 2009 rules regarding the rear diffuser. All of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels. This contrasts with the designs of Toyota and Williams which interpret the new regulations slightly differently."

[fivebob]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.

Where does it state that in the F1 Technical Regulations???

[JustinSpiderholden]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.

Where does it state that in the F1 Technical Regulations???

It doesn't any where

Its jsut Mclaren, Ferrari, Reanult and Red Bull are upset becasue

They didn't think of it, I'm sure if the shoe was on the other foot with these teams there wouldnt be any complaints

McLaren are slow this season is that because they wern't able to cheat and copy Ferrari's car this year

At least we will get to see if Hamilton genunily has talent or was jsut given a good car

[Adamal]

I seriously wonder why you think that Hamilton doesn't have any talent.
He may have had a better car, but the difference in F1 cars isn't the same as the different between a GT-R Skyline vs a GTE Skyline.

In his 2007 season, he came second equal with his team mate, Alonso, who has been racing in F1 a lot longer and has won the Championship before. A proven winner.

Yet this doesn't satisfy you that Hamilton is actually a good driver? Was the McLaren so good, that it could turn an average Joe Blogs into an F1 champion?

The whole argument about him having a good car, and relying on that is null and void. Even though I don't like him, Alonso is a great driver, and he was equaled by Hamilton in the exact same car. Really, what arguement can you put up against that?

[fivebob]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.

Where does it state that in the F1 Technical Regulations???

It doesn't any where

Exactly Three teams read the rules and (independently) saw an oppurtunity to get better aerodynamics and still be within those rules. Seven teams failed to do so, and they really ought to know better that there is always an advantage to creative rule interpretation that they should be looking for.

IMHO In an attempt to be precise the FIA created a set of rules that are too wordy and open to different interpretations, which is exactly what happened.

Its jsut Mclaren, Ferrari, Reanult and Red Bull are upset becasue

Red Bull seem to be the only ones making protest noises right now, don't think I've ever seen a comment from McLaren about it.

McLaren are slow this season

Slow... or sandbagging

is that because they wern't able to cheat and copy Ferrari's car this year

As far as I was aware the FIA found no parts of McLaren's car were copied from Ferrari, but I guess some dogs just can't face getting rid of that old bone

At least we will get to see if Hamilton genunily has talent or was jsut given a good car

Nope, if he does good (and I'm sure he will) the detractors will just say that McLaren were sandbagging

[Mr Revhead]

come on justin, get a new line


fivebob, are you in melbourne at the moment?
whats the light like at 8-9pm local time? seeing as the race doesnt start till 7pm local i'd be thinking it'll be getting a little dark in the later stages. especially if the weather is a bit dodgy. that will make it interesting, albert park is quite closes in so shade and shadows will be rather prevalant!

[thornz]

:lol: come on justin, get a new line


fivebob, are you in melbourne at the moment?
whats the light like at 8-9pm local time? seeing as the race doesnt start till 7pm local i'd be thinking it'll be getting a little dark in the later stages. especially if the weather is a bit dodgy. that will make it interesting, albert park is quite closes in so shade and shadows will be rather prevalant!

Doesnt the race start at 7pm our time? Just looking at the sky guide, and thats what time the coverage starts. So it would only be 5pm or 4pm depending on if they have daylight savings or not.

[JustinSpiderholden]

:lol: come on justin, get a new line


fivebob, are you in melbourne at the moment?
whats the light like at 8-9pm local time? seeing as the race doesnt start till 7pm local i'd be thinking it'll be getting a little dark in the later stages. especially if the weather is a bit dodgy. that will make it interesting, albert park is quite closes in so shade and shadows will be rather prevalant!

I will have a new line at the end of the season when he is no longer world champion

The race is starting at 5pm Melbourne time so that should be 7pm Kiwi time

I'm so excited about this race 1st time in ages F1 might actually be intresting

[fivebob]

fivebob, are you in melbourne at the moment?

Sadly I no longer reside in Melbourne, got made redundant last year, so for the first time in 12 years I will not hear the sounds of an F1 engine echoing out across Albert Park

whats the light like at 8-9pm local time? seeing as the race doesnt start till 7pm local i'd be thinking it'll be getting a little dark in the later stages.

Race starts at 5pm local and should finish about 6:45pm, it's still daylight savings time but it will be shaded on quite a bit of the track. Turn 3 should be interesting

especially if the weather is a bit dodgy.

It's Melbourne, the weather is always dodgy

[Mr Revhead]

oh yeah, 5pm there time

[Jdawg]

An explanation of sorts about the rear diffuser issue for those that don't know

The rear diffuser rules which state all of the channels are the same height and length, with no difference in height between the main central section and the side channels.

Where does it state that in the F1 Technical Regulations???

3.9 Bodywork between the rear wheels:
3.10 Bodywork behind the rear wheel centre line:

And I was pointing out the area of contention, not making a ruling of the legality. Also note Williams and Toyota have differing designs but both involve redesigning the rear crash structure and its bodywork so it effectively becomes part of the rear diffuser or not depending on your point of view