KP starlet with 4AGE

[Madaz]

Hey folks,

long time member been dormat mainly though.

After getting rid of the WRx and needing something to keep me busy during the summer months thought id get a project beast and thought what else better than an old school beast!

Essentially im considering a KP starlet with flares, wide rims and lowered with a 4AGE and lsd.

I figure im going to need a old school Supra gearbox too.

Will the (older) 4AGE engines go right into the starlet? Much butchering of the loom be needed?

Any help/advice you can give would be muchly appreciated!

[Dell'Orto]

You'll need different mounts to make a 4AGE fit but its not hard, been done millions of times before. Oldschool Supra box will likely be a W5x box, which is A. massive overkill for a NA 4AGE and B. The bellhousing to mate a 4AGE to a W series box is like $800. All you need is a T50 from a AE86.
Depending on which version of 4AGE you use, there is a chap on TM who does cut down ecu looms to make it incredibly easy to wire in.

[frost]

whats your budget? and how much of a project are you after? easy slap together or something different?

[Adamal]

I've got a mate who is selling his 4AGE KP. Not sure if he's sold it though

[mr30%jr]

well you have to remeber fuel... for EFI unless your going carbs. theres no returns n shit.

the wiring, isnt easy if you have never wired up engine transplants. would be safe to say youd need to add a few relays and few fused feeds for things.

im not sure of the diff thats in a kp from standard but they are deffinatly drum setup and for and i dont think you can get and lsd centre for one...

so a bigger diff would be on the cards. drive shaft to boot.

you could cheat and do it all on the budget using the original diff a k50 from and ae85 which the starlet allready has a gearbox Xmember for. that will bolt right up to a 4a

further that your going to need to obtain or modify a 4age to fit... water lines are different from rwd to fwd, intake faces the wrong way, mounts are non existant

[Madaz]

erm i was hoping to get an old school carby 4AGE and stick some nice shiny trumpets on it. Im wanting to keep the engine setup as simple as possible.

If its an older version it should be ready for a RWD car anyway right?

OK, so it seems like the gearbox from a ae86 would be the go. Are these hard to find.

I guess in terms of what i want, is probably a cheap banger starlet with no wof or rego.
Strip it back to bare metal and junk all the interior. Remove rust and primer it myself before getting it sprayed by a friend who is a spray painter.

Id like to put 2 bucket seats in and leave it bare in the back. On the mechanical front id expect to be able to remove the engine and mount the 4AGE myself.

Prob have to get the gearbox/exhaust/wiring done by someone who knows more than me lol.

Can i use a locked diff?

I figure i can do

[rollaholic]

you can use a locked diff for sure. longevity behind 4age is questionable, particularly if you plan to use it for what locked diffs are used for

there are TRD LSDs for those diffs (U code? some k series nut will confirm) but pretty hard to find.

anything with the words AE86 in it is going to be worth gold, particularly driveline stuff. i sold an AE86 gearbox about a year ago for 750 without a problem. the boxes themselves are not super expensive, couple of hundred, but bell housings are. its probably still your best option though in terms of reliability, although a K50 does have the advantage of being cable type so you can probably adapt the standard starlet stuff to suit whereas the T50 will want hydraulic.

as far as i know the G heads never came with standard carbs, so you are into aftermarket expense there. that shit aint cheap, and not necessarily any simpler than injection either.

[Mr Revhead]

4ages were only ever injected.
if you want carbs and have to buy them (ie dont have a set form back in the day lying around) it will be pretty much the same price as aftermarket ecu.
last time i looked (a while ago though) new sidedraughts were circa $700 each. less manifold.

[Leon]

you can use a locked diff for sure.

We killed a Starlet locked diff in about two events using just a very old 4K.

Also, locked diff = not road legal

[Madaz]

you can use a locked diff for sure.

We killed a Starlet locked diff in about two events using just a very old 4K.

Also, locked diff = not road legal

This is what i was essentially getting at. Will i be ok for road use with a locked diff lol.

So i need some sort of LSD too.

I think im going to try and go with the blacktop 4AGE engine, as from research i can see the stock clutch, flywheel and pressure plate will work with the t50 gearbox. This would make life much easier.

Anyone confirm/deny?

[QikStarlie]

any 4age clutch and flywheel will work with t50. but 4agze wont.

20v engines are harder to fit as they are setup for fwd. dizzy and thermosat housing out the back when in rwd format, so will need firewall mods. 16v doesn't

u code lsd's are pretty rare. but the od one pops up on trademe,

[mr30%jr]

what we are all getting at is its not a cheap and easy venture.

if you havent done any playing with somethign thats allready got a 4age in it can be a little tricky.

putting a t series engine can be an interesting venture and much easier too, look at all the options

[rollaholic]

Also, locked diff = not road legal

very true, though for some reason i still see plenty around in the right circles (mainly old toyota circles, hah)

[Madaz]

i realise its not going to be that cheap or easy, but i thought that seen as the 4AGE is THE engine in toyota circles, if i will indeed do a starley project then this is the engine i will use.

I was to keep everything as "old school" as possible, so it will be a 16v one.

[d1 mule]

putting a t series engine can be an interesting venture and much easier too, look at all the options

i fail to see why people bother with T series, you probobly get the car sll foing for a little bit cheaper but will always regret skimping out.......

[mr30%jr]

putting a t series engine can be an interesting venture and much easier too, look at all the options

i fail to see why people bother with T series, you probobly get the car sll foing for a little bit cheaper but will always regret skimping out.......

why would you regret spending less money getting the same power and having an easier install..

a 2tgeu is perfect for a starlet after all you have to remeber your dealing with a a 1970-80s eco hatch

[ezy10s]

4age is super easy conversion- engine mounts are available for purchase through a couple different places here in nz(one being import enhancements in lower hutt- who also by the way does a three wire hook up conversion wiring loom to suit rwd 4age conversions)
as for return lines- couple ways to sort that out- one is to rob a second kp of its fuel line and fit that to your one- the clips holding the orignasl line to the body actually have a spare position which makes things easy- fialing finding another kp to rob you can purchasse a length of 5/15 bundy tube from appco/bnt and bend it to shape using your original fuel line as a template. as for feeding the return line back into the fuel tank you can remove the breather pot from the top of the tank and use its position on the tsnk to return the fuel into- for a new breather you can drill a small hole in the fuel cap it self- if you look in the cap you can figure out where to drill so that fuel cant leak from it during heavy cornering(bit hard for me to explain with words sorry).
t50 gearbox is best option(yes you will pay up about 6-750 for a complete setup unfortunately)- you can actually use the kp crossmember with the t50 mount on it by drilling two holes in the right place-(it even looks pretty factory!)- drive shaft will require modifiying- will need to have a t50 input shaft grafted to the original kp drive shaft which is no biggie for drive line shops.
The only other RWD only part you will need is the inlet manifold, everything else can easily be adapted from FWD 4age parts

4age are getting on in years but the t series engines predate these and it is geting harder to find replacement parts for them. I havent wieghed the tow back to back but surely the 2tgeu with its rather bulkish dimensions would be the heavyweight of two?
Oh just a thought i hope by 2t you guys arent referring to the single cam 2t engines- as side by side the 4age out performs them in every which way possible in std form.

[Madaz]

maybe i should chuck a 12A into it and go around saying to people "its a rotor au".

[frost]

got heaps of 4age parts if your going ahead with it, rwd stuff,

[Madaz]

maybe i should chuck a 12A into it and go around saying to people "its a rotor au".