3sgte tuning

[ihavelift]

I REALLY want to retune my engine.

Currently running an Apexi power FC @ 16.2psi

It's running rich (apparently this is to preserve engine life/make it safer?) and has pretty bad vacuum leak (BOV goes pshhhh for ages after i take foot of the gas)

Massive lag until agout 4500-5000rpm when all hell breaks loose

If it makes any difference engine is bone stock except for Apexi air intake and full 3" HKS Silent Hipower exhaust with custom downpipe. done about 200kms (treated like a queen though)

Running 183kwatw (i thought it was 193, turns out it's not according to last owner)

So what I'm asking (just because I like to know things before I do them), is:

1) how much coin should I allocate for a retune?
2) where do people recommend I get it done? - last place was Torque Performance I believe and to be honest I'm not overly happy with what they achieved
3) What should I consider when tuning and what should I aim for (ie psi and kw) - I heard going beyond 16psi is detrimental to stock internals.

If anybody had a few words on the matter that'd be choice!

EDIT: Im thinking this belongs in the tech section? sorry if it does

[JustinSpiderholden]

Just search on here there are plenty of threads about this

[tsoob]

phone soichi at st hitec or kent at speed source.

allow at least 500 bucks maybe a little more

[Akane]

1) Last time I got mine tuned it costed me $800 and they blew the headgasket.
3) the lean trick on low RPM, part throttle tune not just WOT.

[ihavelift]

1) Last time I got mine tuned it costed me $800 and they blew the headgasket.
3) the lean trick on low RPM, part throttle tune not just WOT.

what's the lean trick? and what's the difference between a part throttle tune and WOT? (apart from the obvious)

[Heylin]

183KW sounds about right at 16Psi with good AFR, with my old stuffed fuel pump I managed 190Kw at 11.2 AFR. (pump was barely keeping up so made near perfect AFR....fluke)

im running a similar setup with a few extras

- link G4
- CT20b
- Pod Filter
- 3" dump pipe and Fujitsubo Legalis R Exhuast
- 100mm intercooler with extra fans
- SARD 280LPH Fuel Pump and Regulator

Personally I wouldnt go higher than 19psi on stock internals, my MR2 is over 200K mark as well and has been babied all its life, but my tuner (Wayne @ Cartune in Hamilton) is doing a conservative level of 16psi. With correct tuning and aiming for AFR of 12.3 it should produce 200+ KW.

Before going to much higher, id get a fuel pump flow test to make sure your stock pump is flowing the right amount still (Stock is 180 LPH), and mabey a compression test to gauge the condition of your rings.

Id then aim for 16-19PSI boost, tuned to a safe AFR of 12.3 and be happy with that power for now. Some extra intercooling wouldnt go amiss either.

Im running a cheap Greddy style IC with ATS fan ($600NZ all up) and getting nice chilly peak outlet temps of 32 deg C on the dyno, no fans, and at full boost). Stock IC couldnt dream make those sort of temps.

[ihavelift]

turns out i need to leave my car at the shop for a whole day to get the fuel pump checked. WTF???

and can i get a compression test done at a tuning specialist?

[tsoob]

turns out i need to leave my car at the shop for a whole day to get the fuel pump checked. WTF???

and can i get a compression test done at a tuning specialist?

hehe its not drive thru mcdonalds bro.

any mechanic should be able to do a compression test, a lot of tuners will do it before tuning a car

[Prymal]

Suichi ( St Hitec )is about a grand + to tune but knows PFC like a champ .. he recently tuned Franks Group A St205 , and got a healthy 250 odd KW at the wheels .. ( mind you franks engine is very upspecced and modified )

[®usty]

question classique71 what one of the 5 GT4 group A is yours? have you got any pictures?

[ST205 GT4 NZ New Group A]

In my humble opinion next step for you is

1. air to air front mount intercooler, -$400-500 ( best mod as it flows a lot better- quicker more response to rev)
2. and then high flow turbo. $800-100 Steve Mirch?? Tsoobs' mate ?

Probably your injectors are max ed out any way ??

Really I would be pretty happy with that power considering that you have a reliable package and have not spent any money on the car having bought it already tuned.

The Power FC in that car was my old one which was already mapped the old owner bought it and had TP put it in and "tune it " I think they charged him $1500 to $2000 interesting as it was already mapped.

But hey you got the bug "chasing the dragon " I know you can't help it but, i couldn't !

[JustinSpiderholden]

In my humble opinion next step for you is

1. air to air front mount intercooler, -$400-500 ( best mod as it flows a lot better- quicker more response to rev)
2. and then high flow turbo. $800-100 Steve Mirch?? Tsoobs' mate ?

Probably your injectors are max ed out any way ??

Really I would be pretty happy with that power considering that you have a reliable package and have not spent any money on the car having bought it already tuned.

The Power FC in that car was my old one which was already mapped the old owner bought it and had TP put it in and "tune it " I think they charged him $1500 to $2000 interesting as it was already mapped.

But hey you got the bug "chasing the dragon " I know you can't help it but, i couldn't !

I dont understand how going to a front mount on a ST205 is not going to give you better responce or even flow better

As isn't it going to take longer to presureise all the required piping plus filling the intercooler?

You don't see many rally ST205's with front mounts

[sergei]

W/A is better for ~200kW atw. Also stock injectors are fine for that power.

[Akane]

1) Last time I got mine tuned it costed me $800 and they blew the headgasket.
3) the lean trick on low RPM, part throttle tune not just WOT.

what's the lean trick? and what's the difference between a part throttle tune and WOT? (apart from the obvious)

It's called the lean spool trick, any tuner should be able to do that for you. Some tuners only tune for max power, ie: only the load settings under WOT, and they don't care much about part throttle

[®usty]

I've seen someone make 250KW with the stock intercooler

[iOnic]

I dont understand how going to a front mount on a ST205 is not going to give you better responce or even flow better

As isn't it going to take longer to presureise all the required piping plus filling the intercooler?

You don't see many rally ST205's with front mounts

You don't see many rally cars with front mounts because frount mounted intercoolers are in a compromising position as far as damage goes. Rally cars have a tendency to hit things - generally quite hard too. Top mounts/w2a are used in that situation for reliability more than power/response - you can drive into a tree and complete the stage with only cosmetic damage rather than driving into a tree and losing boost altogether.. Yes they do flow better - they have more volume than the stock system which = less restriction. On the other side of the sword, because of the added volume, response is lost - but not so much that the car is un-drivable - good turbo choice comes into play here. Evo's come with factory front mounted intercoolers and they are some of the most responsive turbocharged cars around...

Yes you can make 250kw (and probably more) with the stock intercooler. But you can just as easily also disconnect the wastegate and have unlimited boost potential - just because it "can" be done doesn't make it a good idea....

[Adamal]

1) Last time I got mine tuned it costed me $800 and they blew the headgasket.
3) the lean trick on low RPM, part throttle tune not just WOT.

what's the lean trick? and what's the difference between a part throttle tune and WOT? (apart from the obvious)

It's called the lean spool trick, any tuner should be able to do that for you. Some tuners only tune for max power, ie: only the load settings under WOT, and they don't care much about part throttle

Its the same for any engine. The air required by the engine at a given point in the rev range is going to change. Depending on how open the throttle is effects the speed that the air is able to flow.
The more air you've got going down a tube, the smaller the tube, the faster the air must go to get the same volume through it.
By going WOT at lower RPM, the air isn't going to go as fast through the piping as it could do, as theres nothing restricting the pipe size to allow for optimal air speed through the pipe.

[sergei]

I dont understand how going to a front mount on a ST205 is not going to give you better responce or even flow better

As isn't it going to take longer to presureise all the required piping plus filling the intercooler?

You don't see many rally ST205's with front mounts

You don't see many rally cars with front mounts because frount mounted intercoolers are in a compromising position as far as damage goes. Rally cars have a tendency to hit things - generally quite hard too. Top mounts/w2a are used in that situation for reliability more than power/response - you can drive into a tree and complete the stage with only cosmetic damage rather than driving into a tree and losing boost altogether.. Yes they do flow better - they have more volume than the stock system which = less restriction. On the other side of the sword, because of the added volume, response is lost - but not so much that the car is un-drivable - good turbo choice comes into play here. Evo's come with factory front mounted intercoolers and they are some of the most responsive turbocharged cars around...

Yes you can make 250kw (and probably more) with the stock intercooler. But you can just as easily also disconnect the wastegate and have unlimited boost potential - just because it "can" be done doesn't make it a good idea....

More volume = more volume to fill = less response.
More volume != less restriction
Bigger piping != more power

Evos don't use W/A as it is too expensive.


If you look at stock W/A I/C you will see it is not restrictive, it is actually well designed unit, not your standard bar/plate front mount.
Have a read here of pros/cons of W/A:
http://www.are.com.au/feat/techt/airwaterinter.htm

[JustinSpiderholden]

I've seen someone make 250KW with the stock intercooler

There is nothing wrong with the stock intercooler, for everyday useage

For a street car aiming for less than 250kw there is no point in changing the factory intercooler

Unles you want the wow "Check out that guys front mount comments"

In which case you may was well jsut join the choosen few

[sergei]

I've seen someone make 250KW with the stock intercooler

There is nothing wrong with the stock intercooler, for everyday useage

For a street car aiming for less than 250kw there is no point in changing the factory intercooler

Unles you want the wow "Check out that guys front mount comments"

In which case you may was well jsut join the choosen few

What he said, and also there is no point of going over ~250kW on street car either.