More camber - ST165

[RS13]

Hi guys,

Trying to get a bit more camber on the front of an ST165 racecar, it has WRX or Legacy adjustables which are almost fully adjusted for negative camber at the top hat, but it still understeers badly and chews the sidewalls out, even at 40psi. Any ideas? Are we able to use an ST185 bits at all? Or anything aftermarket you'd recommend?

[d1 mule]

how much camber is it running?? could be a toe issue rather than camber

[RS13]

how much camber is it running?? could be a toe issue rather than camber

Not too sure, haven't checked it.. does toe really improve turn-in that much though?

[iOnic]

Do you want more camber as in wheel closer to 0deg/Neutral or more negative camber as in going from -2 to -4deg (as an example)

If the budget allows for it, you could modify the knuckles/strut mounts to give you whatever camber angle you'd like but if you're already chewing out sidewalls and understeering badly I'd say dial out as much camber as possible (go closer to 0deg) to get more tyre on the tarmac.

[d1 mule]

toe, castor and camber all affect each other.

like of you wind massive castor in you will get toe in/out depending where the steering connects tot he hub.

are you chewing inner or outer sidewalls???

[RS13]

Sorry, should have been more specific. The hats are almost fully adjusted out for negative camber, I'd say around -3. It has a factory bottom arm, so I think we're at the limit of what we can get negative camber-wise. The problem is, it just won't turn in.. so as a consequence of this, as he's turning in harder than he needs to, its' scrubbing away the outer sidewalls mostly but a little inner sidewall as well.

I was kinda hoping that something off another gen Celica could fit.. St185 perhaps.. as he's looking at upgrading the front brakes to ST185 units anyway. As it is, he wants me to cut and weld a section into the factory bottom arms, which I'd really rather not do.. I'd prefer something aftermarket and adjustable, but can't seem to find much online.

[fxgt race]

Check out your castor.I have the same understeering problem in my race car at the moment, I have just changed to 5deg castor so when you turn in it gives more negative camber, as before it was giving more postive camber as i turned.

[matt dunn]

I take it that it is a circuit car? What does it have for a front diff, open or LSD of some type?

and toe makes massive differences

[RunningRich]

ST165 needs more caster. Whiteline (from memory) do front lower arm rear offset bushings which allow a couple of more degrees. The difference in turn in is amazing. Run lots of camber and zero toe. A little negative toe improves turn in as well but makes them a little figidty.


http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/bush.htm

I did all this well over a decade ago now do memory is fuzzy...

[sergei]

ST165 needs more caster. Whiteline (from memory) do front lower arm rear offset bushings which allow a couple of more degrees. The difference in turn in is amazing. Run lots of camber and zero toe. A little negative toe improves turn in as well but makes them a little figidty.


http://gtfour.supras.org.nz/bush.htm

I did all this well over a decade ago now do memory is fuzzy...

I installed those those bushes and they made huge difference (positive) in handling.

[Malcolm]

castor:


caster:


that is all.

[RS13]

I take it that it is a circuit car? What does it have for a front diff, open or LSD of some type?

and toe makes massive differences

Yeah current owner wants it set up for circuit, but apparently it did a 1.11 around Ashley Forest back in the day with a conservative driver so its' not too bad on gravel!

Its' an ST165 with ST215 engine and turbo, link ECU, ST185 gearbox so whatever they have, open I'd assume.

So, whiteline offset bushes for the lower arm, zero toe, more caster?