Blacktop VVT pulley wear signs

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Blacktop VVT pulley wear signs

Postby jacobrjett » Mon Mar 26, 2012 11:07 pm

bought a BZR couple days ago,

was running mint, engine sounded healthy and has a brand new wof and regd until november brand new tyres heaps of clutch very smooth gearbox, has had the superstruts replaced in the last 6 months, seemed to be a mint car, friend of mine was going to come check it out with me but i couldn't get hold of him but it looked good and had a good feeling about the car so went ahead and bought it. got it for 3500 with 220kms on the clock. (and a full tank of gas :wink:)

well thats the story behind it, didn't post it in the new members section because i figured most people wont give a shit.

anyway, car was running mint for a few hours, until I decided to make sure the motor went well. Did a first, second and third gear pull from the lights by paramata to make sure it was goin good. everything went well. (I am a very sensible driver and would generally only do that under controlled conditions but I had to test it out - its a performance car after all, got to make sure it performs right?)

about 20 minutes later I heard some ticking. :cry:

I had heard a similar noise before in my mates hilux, and i had a ae101 that I had bought for spare parts with a blown engine and it sounded quite similar. immediately assumed it was the bottom end bearings and that the guy had sold me a $&#$% car. the stick read the oil was full. I drove straight back home, parked it up. mechanic friend of mine came over and checked it out about an hour after this. when we started it, the noise was significantly quieter. He said it might not be the bottom end because otherwise it would be a constant and loud noise. (but then he jacked it up and listened from underneath and said it was knocking from underneath so it might be) It seemed to be knocking quietly at idle, like knocking on a wooden door, then if you actuate the throttle a bit to around 2200-3000 a loud tapping noise comes on, which sounds more like drumming with a couple spoons on a metal block.

I read that the VVT activates when you turn the motor over. When you start the motor, and you get that little surge of rev that comes and settles down just after you start the motor, it ticks really really loudly for like one second, then settles down and you cant hear anything. That, and the fact that once you rev the motor a wee bit higher, maybe around 4000rpm the ticking stops completely. (after coming on at around ~2300rpm)

So I read sometimes the VVT gear can crap out and make a ticking noise. I am REALLY hoping it might be this because it sounds cheaper to fix :)

Anyway so what are things I could look at to try confirm weather its just the VVT pulley or not? Or would this most likely be a rooted motor? I should have another mechanic around to check it out soon but I don't have much patience, ive spent ages on the net trying to find out vvt pulley wear systems but theres not much info, other then it can happen...


If its in need of a rebuild I wont be too disappointed. Sure it will cost a fair bit but I was thinking I could get some ACL bearings and silvertop con-rods installed while im at it, meaning in the future if I ever wanted more power I am set to chuck some cams and springs in the head with a ECU :wink:
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Postby Leon » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:11 am

I've had a couple of blacktop vvti pulley's show wear. There doesn't seem to be one specific go-to symptom though.

I had one that ticked loudly at idle, and a second one that started ticking from 3500 up.

Your best bet might be to get a mechanic with a stethascope in there to see if he can narrow the noise down to that one specific place.
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Postby headshotnz » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:12 am

Welcome to Toy-Speed mate. Ill come have a listen to this engine of yours.
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Postby jacobrjett » Tue Mar 27, 2012 10:20 am

cheers james. you free tomorrow after 3?
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Postby headshotnz » Tue Mar 27, 2012 11:52 am

maybe about 530 i have course then bro. ill let you know mate
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Postby jacobrjett » Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:01 pm

sweet ill try get hold of you (hopefully i can top up my mobile cellular telecommunication device by then)

leon, thanks for the input that sounds like good advice, i would never have thought of using a stethoscope.

family friend mechanic apprentice is bringing his workmate over soon (wednesday arvo i think) to check it out - hes from the johnsonville mechanics just across the road from subway, do they know their stuff when it comes to 4ages? i will get hold of him and hopefully they have a stethoscope to pinpoint the noise!!! (I am not driving it at the moment because I am worried I will cause more damage!)


also, I am not experienced much with cars, I took the oil cap off and tried to have a look in there, and I can kind of see... I dont know what it is, valves or something? I can see internal parts of the engine, is that normal or is it supposed to be hidden by the oil or something?

cheers


edit;;;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H0RVZCH5xqw&feature=youtube_gdata
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Postby Leon » Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:49 pm

jacobrjett wrote:hes from the johnsonville mechanics just across the road from subway, do they know their stuff when it comes to 4ages?


Go to Johnsonville Car Maintenance, (cnr Basset / Ohariu Rd, beside the Challenge / GAS Station - can't recall what brand name they are at the moment). Ask for Andy.

1) he's a good bastard

2) he has many 4age

Say Leon said you should go bother him ;)

Yes you should be seeing cams and stuff when you look in the oil cap. If it was submerged in oil that woud mean you'd have like 50 litres of oil in the engine not 4, and nothing would move because it would be submerged in oil. Don't run the engine without the oil cap on, cos you'll get oil all over the engine bay as it will be spraying under pressure in there.
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Postby jacobrjett » Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:24 am

ok thanks leon. I will go bother him soon. firstly I want to try figure out if my car is save to drive though :cry:

Shall I do an oil change to see if the bottom end bearings have failed? (there should be shit in the oil if so right?)
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Postby jacobrjett » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:57 pm

damn, the mechanic from jville auto can't come around until the weekend.


aaaargh this is driving me nuts lol. i want to drive it!!! :lol:
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Postby Leon » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:18 pm

jacobrjett wrote:Shall I do an oil change to see if the bottom end bearings have failed? (there should be shit in the oil if so right?)


Yes, and yes. In reply to those two questions.

You will see metallic flakes in the bottom of the tray after you drain the oil out of the tray following the oil change. Like panning for gold, only it SUCKS when you find this type of gold
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Postby jacobrjett » Wed Mar 28, 2012 8:40 pm

ok. thanks for your advice dude!

id like to take it to the mechanic you recommended in jville but i want to wait for someone to check it out and tell me its safe to drive first :cry:

ill do the oil change tomorrow and post up how it went.
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Postby CAMB01 » Thu Mar 29, 2012 11:03 am

Sounds like big end bearing to me in that video. Can come have a listen if you want and give my diagnosis.
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Postby jacobrjett » Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:28 pm

mate that would be wicked when about are you free?
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Postby ch4ng » Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:10 pm

hate to say it man but you've got both VVT cam pulley noise AND bottom end noise

DON'T drive it untill its been checked out
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Postby jacobrjett » Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:32 pm

this is BS

why me :x :(


well, assuming it needs rebuilding or replacing, whats the average cost one pays for a engine swap? i saw a black top on trademe for like 995 bucks with like 80 bucks to ship it here, would it be like 500 to install it?

considering its the exact same engine and it should fit easily, would it be too big of a DIY job? i can most likely get hold of an engine hoist off my godfather, and im one who always likes to give something a go and it would be cool to say i did it myself - however i dont want to end up with another engine in there that doesn't work :wink:

what do you guys think
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Postby RobertC » Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:07 pm

fairly straight forward job to just chuck in another engine. Swapped mine a few months back. Having never removed an engine before got it done in a day.


Should be able to get something for less than $1000 considering you wont need throttle bodies, starter, alternator etc.

Ive got a spare blacktop in the shed done 190,000kms uses a bit of oil but still runs well. Could do for $600. (its in whangarei)
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Postby Dell'Orto » Thu Mar 29, 2012 10:12 pm

Nah its pretty easy really, get a couple of mates around and you could easily get it done in a weekend
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Postby jacobrjett » Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:22 am

guess im just gonna suck it up and buy a new engine then. (after the mechanic has had a proper look in the weekend) ill see if i can source one with less then 150k kms on it first but if i cant ill buy yours robertc, cheers for the offer dude

oh well i can still use my mrs car for the next few months until its sorted and it should be a nice little car when it gets a new motor...
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Postby rollaholic » Fri Mar 30, 2012 12:24 pm

man i would be spewing
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Postby jacobrjett » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:07 pm

i bet most people would be, i felt awful when i figured out something was wrong with it. I considered trying to get my money back but i was told because i did the trade outside of trademe, and it was a private seller I had no grounds on it. and the guy said "it was fine when i sold it to you, so theres nothing I can or need to do" and he left for his OE on wednesday anyway.

though getting pissed about it is not going to help me, i will just stay positive about it. pay my boss back (i borrowed 800 from my boss toward it) then start saving for a new motor!!! should be a nice little go-kart when its got a new motor. because the rest of the car is fine and quite tidy.

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