Is my Wide Band O2 sensor reading off

[steroidcontaskie]

Hi all

I have an Innovate LC-1 and their DB Guage installed in my car and the sensor was calibrated as per the instructions.

The car has a MAP ECU 3 installed and a base Map that is meant to emulate the factory Map loaded on.

The car starts and runs fine, but the gauge is ready a A/F of 9.5-10:1 while at idle and between 9.5 - 12.0 while doing some gentle driving (turbo conversion and not tuned so cant give it the beans). I have tried to lean the fuel Map out, but that causes a miss then makes the car stall out.

While driving around there is no sign of black smoke from the exhaust and doesnt seem to be running rich.

Would the car run ok and not smoke with an A/F of 9.5-10:1? or does it sound like I have a bad wide band sensor?

Cheers
Edward

[Girvs]

I know of one innovative unit that was returned for being faulty, but otherwise they're quite reputable.
9.5 I would have said is getting a bit too lean. Does the ECU have a way of data logging? If so, I'd be getting that running while you go for your drive, it'll give you a better indication of what is going on than just looking at the AFR gauge.

[steroidcontaskie]

I can log from the ECU, and will have a go at doing that. See if the readings are the same as the gauge or different.

Could be lots of things that are my fault and not the wideband (such as a bad earth on the gauge). I guess I am really looking for an idea if the reading on the wideband is off and if it is, then if it is I can problem solve from there, starting with wiring and grounds and working my way back to the components being faulty.

Cheers
Edward

[Burning Angel]

9.5 I would have said is getting a bit too lean.

9.5 isn't lean its rich, stoichiometric is about 14.7

[Girvs]

9.5 I would have said is getting a bit too lean.

9.5 isn't lean its rich, stoichiometric is about 14.7

Thanks for the correction. Not sure why I got them the wrong way around

[loose_unit]

Innovates are usually pretty good, in my expereince they either read correct or else they just throw an error. My last sensor was reading properly right up until it all of a sudden threw a heater error, ie sensor stuffed.

[blindnz]

An excellent image of this

[jondee86]

The car has a MAP ECU 3 installed and a base Map that is meant
to emulate the factory Map loaded on.

Factory map would be based on factory injectors. Have you increased
the injector size ?

Cheers... jondee86

[saft]

did you calibrate the LC-1 ?
does it have the right curves loaded for output voltage?

[steroidcontaskie]

Hi

The car is currently on the factory injectors and the sensor was calibrated in air as the manual described.

The Gauge was hooked by as per the manufactures instructions and they did not say that you needed to change the settings. ( I am guessing that the output for the gauge is pre-calibrated).

I will get the software loaded and check that setting are all ok this weekend.

Cheers
Edward

[RomanV]

One other thing, your O2 sensor isnt directly sampling combustion in a cylinder, it's taking a sample of gas from all of the cylinders combined, spat out the arse end of the engine.

If one cylinder was lean or rich or whatever, (or exhaust leak prior to O2?) then it throws off the average.

[Mr Ree]

I run the same gauge, and will admit that from time to time, it needs to be recalibrated, but its no biggie.

I think the best course of action is to start with your wiring. IIRC, you should share a very good quality communal earth point with the ECU.

Also, check all your connections again, and make sure none of them are loose.

Just checking that you are still running the factory FPR?

[steroidcontaskie]

I will have a check of all the wiring and make sure that isnt a problem. I still have the factory FPR, but I do have a Walbro fuel pump installed. Is it a good idea to upgrade the FPR?

Cheers
Edward

[Mr Ree]

No, at your power level, the factory regulator, lines and rail are fine.

But for the record, It sure is one of the most common items people like to waste money on Mmmm, shiny stuff in the engine bay lol

[jondee86]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the MAP ECU is a piggyback... yes ??
And if you run it over the top of the factory ECU, and you are not
running any boost, then the MAP ECU should not be changing
anything... correct ??

So if the MAP ECU is running corrections, it could be adding fuel
where no fuel needs to be added... maybe ??

If you have the N/A factory ECU and have fitted the F/A injectors,
you could be overfueling... possible ??

Just floating a few ideas

Cheers... jondee86

[Mr Ree]

Whoops I forgot to ask...are you still connecting the factory narrow band 02 sensors?

[steroidcontaskie]

The map ecu is a piggyback ecu, it mostly intercepts and modifies the factory signals. But for fueling it works a bit differently, it replaces the factory MAP sensor and hence gives the factory ecu a totally different signal. I have a base map loaded on the ecu that is meant to emulate the way the factory MAP sensors signals, but who knows how accurate it is. Injectors are still factory, but I do have some 550s to put in soon.

I have the lc-1 sending a narrow band signal to the factory ecu, the manual for the lc-1 says that the narrow band signal is set up for voltages the same as the Toyota sensor, but I will load up the software and check that it is calibrated to output the same as orginal.

I guess my main question is does anyone know if a air fuel ratio of 9.5:1 will be so rich that the car will blow smoke, because the car is not blowing smoke, and if should be at that air fuel ratio then my wide band is defiantly off.

Cheers
Edward

[strx7]

depends on the motor, my 13b turbo running 100:1 premix does puff a little smoke when idling in the 9:1 range. a piston engine possibly wont puff smoke at 9:1, you certainly wouldn't see it if driving.

does it smell really rich, or have you not had enough experience with tuning and engines to be able to tell?

[steroidcontaskie]

I dont really know if it smells rich, I will check all the wiring and see if I can pick up any problems there.

Cheers for the help everyone
Edward

[Flannelman]

Pull a sparkplug, it should be brown/tan in colour for correct air/fuel.

If theres black fluffy carbon on the sparkplug then its too rich.