3SGTE intake manifolds

[Grrrrrrr!]

Has anybody got a caldina 3sgte intake manifold not attached to a motor that could grab me some measurements so i can see how different the bolt spacing is? Just want to see if its feasible to redrill/slot a couple of holes and fit it to a gen 2 3sgte head. Ideal would be if you had a gen2 gasket to lay across the manifold and take a photo for me.. but not holding my breath for that one.

The gen3 manifold has the same bolt pattern so one of those would do to.

(And yes, i know the ports on the gen2 head are freaking huge and wont match up, i can work around that so long as the ports on the gen3/4 intake point roughly to the center of the gen2 ports.)

[iOnic]

http://www.chicoraceworks.com/gallery/g ... e_gen2head

[Grrrrrrr!]

Spank you muchly sir!

Not what I was hoping to see, those ports aren't exactly centered in the gen2 ports.

[iOnic]

Port spacing is different between Gen1/2 and Gen3+. If you want a side feed on a Gen2 the easier solution is Gen1 3SGE.

[Grrrrrrr!]

Yep, have been keeping my eyes out for one of those, missed out on one that was out at Zebra due to being disorganised/busy at work, asked on here a few times and nobody had one to sell. Currently tossing up options of buying an almost complete gen3 in pieces and hunting down the missing bits or sticking with the gen2 stuff I have.

[Flannelman]

Port match the manifold to the gasket. Big port breathing with fast air speed of the manifold runners = win

[Grrrrrrr!]

Eh? doesn't big port = slow air speed?

Isn't that why toyota did the tvis thing, to block off half the port and keep air speed high at lower revs for better VE? I seem to remember a bunch of threads by redmist talking about the advantages of filling ports on the 4ages.. and smallport >> bigport 4age isn't it? Ditto gen3&4 3sgte >> gen 2, even with same turbo?


Also it doesn't make a lot of sense to me to have small runners, flaring to big ports then tapering into the back of the valves.

[iOnic]

Unless you are building a drag engine that only makes power up top, big ports = bad

[Flannelman]

Overall, a bigger port AND intake manifold looses low RPM torque due to air speed.

However, a larger port being fed by a smaller manifold will yield improvements from the air speed from the smaller manifold. From the head to the valve is the most restrictive part of the intake track so using a larger port the restriction is reduced. This in turn demands more airflow creating greater airspeed in the manifold.

It has been tested on a Ford V8. A 351C 4V had back to back dyno runs using a different manifold, one that mirrors this exact same situation. The larger stock manifold made 382Hp@6000 and a smaller Edelbrock RPM Air Gap manifold punched out 397@6000. Not only was peak power up, the torque curve was too. The Air Gap made more (391lb/ft V 400lb/ft @ 4000) AND held it over a longer rev range.

So, with the theory and the practical shown, I would expect the 3SGTE to improve in the mid range flowing into the top end with no noticeable loss in the lower rpm by using the small manifold on the bigger port head. WIN

[Crucible]

Clevos have always been known to be flat off the mark compared to Windsors because of the huge intake ports, especially with 4v heads. There was actually an intake kit available that you could adapt or tap threads and bolt 'fillers' into the intake runners to improve low down response and torque.

Even with 2v heads, alloy dual plane manifold and lots of timing they still feel flat as a turd!

Ive never been in a clevo that has turned on and always been more a fan of the windsor even though with ford smallblocks the clevo is praised to be the powerhouse.

[Grrrrrrr!]

How relevant is porting theory from boat anchor 2 valve pushrod v8s to 4 valve OHC engines?

[iOnic]

Regardless of any old V8 theories - making the ports bigger in a 3SGTE is a bad move. They are gigantic. Even Toyota realised this.

[Crucible]

How relevant is porting theory from boat anchor 2 valve pushrod v8s to 4 valve OHC engines?

It doesnt matter what vintage engine how many valves it has or how they are opened, the theory is the same. I am just using as an example.

[Akane]

The port on the gen 2 is tad big, no advantage of it until you're making big HP numbers.

[MilfHunter]

I have studied this and can show you pics as proof.
Gen1 GE has huge ports (around the inlet valves), Gen1 GTE has narrow ports, Gen2 GTE is somewhere between the two.

I have used the gen1 GTE head on a Gen1 GE motor/GE cams/GE inlet and the increase in torque is very noticeable, the smaller porting makes a world of difference below 5000rpm.

Running any of the T-VIS heads without flaps is a bad idea, there are countless threads with dyno figures to demonstrate the ports are just too big to make low rpm power.
Of the 3 the gen2 GTE is the best choice coupled to the gen1 GE inlet. It's a compromise of the earlier two coupled with a better camshaft/bucket setup.

My next motor is a Gen2 GTE head, Gen3 valves, springs, buckets, cams as I'd like to retain the stock ecu with T-VIS running N/A

Most can't be bothered fiddling with combo's and the quick/cheap route is to fit a later GTE motor/harness

[Grrrrrrr!]

I'll have to compare sometime, i have a gen1 GE intake manifold, a gen2 head & tvis plate, from memory the tvis to head gasket was the same part on gen1 GE & gen2 gte.