1jzgte/2jzgte stock twin turbo power gains

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:04 am

Yesterday we did a before and after dyno on a Soarer, specifically testing a set of intake pipes(imported from Kurt Atzmuller in australia). The
theory is that the small diameter pipes leading to the turbos are a restriction. several cars in australia had reported earlier spool up, and boost increases, which showed that they were restricted. But we needed dyno proof.
the car was a Wellington based Jzz30 , with twin dump pipes(a dump off each turbo) a large diameter exhaust system, a Front mount intercooler, with a shift kitted auto trans. The base run was 236 hub kW on The STM dyno at 16psi boost, with no boost controller.
The intake pipes are 3 inch in diameter, narrowing down to 2" just prior to the turbos(not much room between the firewall and the compressor cover on that rear turbo).
After the pipes were installed, Evan-the owner, noted the turbos spooled up earlier. The car gained 2psi boost , to 18psi, and experienced 'missing', so the new plugs were replaced with one range colder and gapped down to accommodate the increased boost. final power was 252 hub kW, an increase of 16kW.
2JZGTE owners in the States have experienced similar results.
There are images available on the "Kurt's intake pipes" thread on www.soarercentral.com

Mr Ree · Post by **Mr Ree** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:36 am

Lots of the chaps on the Oz supra forums are going in on a group buy for these too after seeing the gains that can be had.

When people modify their cars, they tend to focus on how the air gets out, rather than in, but these pipes are proof that its a two way street.

Nice results

MAC_HATER · Post by **MAC_HATER** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:23 am

thats quite interesting!

ive been on the lookout for a stock JZA70 airbox setup with a high flow filter to see if there are any improvments over the simple pod filter setup mine came with - but this system seems to do even better - do they make one for the 1JZ-GTE's or is it just for the 2JZ-GTE's?

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:29 am

Kurt is doing them for the 1jz. or you can have a look at what they are, then do something similar yourself. The key is getting a bigger diameter pipe to each turbo, and having two separate feeds.

trd-drifting · Post by **trd-drifting** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:43 am

Them seem rather worth it, with those gains just read that whole thread as well. Might have to make some for the 2JZ for the time being see if they are worth it.

Cheers blake

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 12:37 pm

yes the 2jz's are reporting about 20hp gain, but they are leaving the factory pipe to the rear turbo intact, and then joining on a pipe and filter. then making a separate larger diameter intake pipe to the front turbo(some incorporating a bell mouth). So a 2jz would see even more gains if they did the twin intake properly.
Only one owner has dynoed them to prove it. The USA supra owners seem to be mainly a group of losers who sit around saying " oh i wish someone would dyno test this mod to see how much it gains", or " i had a big gain- but i changed three or four things at once,so i'm not sure of anything" Of course, there a few fantastic guys who put their money where there mouth is and provide proper testing, dyno results etc.

Mr Ree · Post by **Mr Ree** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:49 pm

I think that is more a case of the newer (read: younger) generation of supra owners who sit around waiting for the world to provide them with empirical data before they get their wallet out. And then want it to be half price and gold plated

As you say though, thankfully there are a group og older chaps who see the value in real world results, rather than speculation

Jonno2002 · Post by **Jonno2002** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:59 pm

correct me if im wrong but wont the stock turbos self destruct at 15+ psi ?

thats pretty nuts power for stock motor, is that factory ecu too ??

mines stock with i/c and 3" exhaust and ported factory wastegates and it boosts 12-13psi and made 196kw atw.

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:46 pm

Hi Jonno. There is a school of thought that suggests that though the turbos are providing higher boost, they are not necessarily working harder. Imagine you had to breath out say 20 litres of air per minute, breathing in through a straw. Then imagine you were told you had to breath out 40 litres per minute, but you no longer had to suck the air in through a straw. So you a pushing more air, but not working harder.
Many of us have been running high boost for years on the factory ceramic CT12As, without any issues. Ones that shatter are usually ones that had a bit of play in them and touched the housing, or were out of balance(a clear sign that the ceramic wheel is about to head towards your muffler)
the guy who holds the current soarer stock turbo record in Australia runs 27psi!
I regularly raced at 19 psi.
Sometimes people are just unlucky, and their ceramics let go at 14 psi.
But one of the keys is the twin dump pipe mod, as it lets a lot of heat out the exhaust quickly, so they don't get so hot. Heat is the enemy of ceramic turbines.
the car on the dyno has a hks f-con piggy back ecu. also they are hub kW, so are generally ten percent higher than a rolling road(dyno dynamics for example) The motor is very low km, in great order. It breathes so well now, 18psi is now the base boost level. He can't run lower max boost.
A 1jz soarer in australia recently gained approx 45rwkw when he went from stock to doing the twin dump pipes, intake pipes and outlet pipes.
A little known fact is that the ceramic CT12B turbos from the jap spec supra are stronger than their reputation. If run in parallel, and in good nick, they handle 20-25 psi no trouble. Often when 2jzs have their boost increased, the sequential operation of the turbos can destroy one of the turbos if one of the VSV is faulty or out of exact sequence. Notice how the 2jz always only blows one turbo, not two?

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:49 pm

BTW Mr Ree, your assessments of my comments are probably very very accurate.

2jayzgte · Post by **2jayzgte** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:09 am

Nice thread Blake I could be interested in a mod like this.

I wonder how much more I could get out of the setup I have with this mod.

If I got an extra 10 odd KW with a mod like this at 1.3 bar I'd be chuffed.

As on that STM Dyno the best my car has seen is about 315 KW at 1.3 bar with the F-Con and BPU mods.

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:26 pm

i think you would see that much, possibly 20kW, as the bigger turbos have more to gain. For instance, if you gained 6.8 percent like Evan's 1jz did, you'd have 336kW.
evan's car will be at masterton drags 14th/15th april if you wish to look. Or he can meet you in welly.

Mr Ree · Post by **Mr Ree** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:23 pm

I would suggest doing it Coryn, but you need to ensure you have the 2 pod filters boxed up with lots of cold air available to them.

You would see some nice gains with your big ol' snails

1.13 here we come

2jayzgte · Post by **2jayzgte** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:30 pm

HMMMMMM you boyz have me thinking now.

I'll have to get some more info about it with pics and talk to my guys at Macbilt about it see if they can work something out for me.

With regards to cold air box you rekon 2 HKS type air filters will do the trick at that end in a cold airbox????

Mr Ree · Post by **Mr Ree** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:34 pm

There is a group buy going on in the Oz supra forums, but I think it seems a bit expensive so It might pay to read that thread in the GB section then take it to macbilt and get him to clone them.

I think any good quality filters will be ok, and provided they can fit in the cold air box, I would say the larger the better

Might even be worth looking into a front feeding box and get a fibreglass mould made of your headlight so when you hit the track you can simply swap it in and guarantee you will have plenty of cold air for them to injest.

2jayzgte · Post by **2jayzgte** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:50 pm

BlakeNZ wrote:i think you would see that much, possibly 20kW, as the bigger turbos have more to gain. For instance, if you gained 6.8 percent like Evan's 1jz did, you'd have 336kW.
evan's car will be at masterton drags 14th/15th april if you wish to look. Or he can meet you in welly.

I wouldn't mind meeting him and seeing the mod for myself to honest.

20 KW with better boost response who needs to go single hahahahaha..

Lith · Post by **Lith** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 6:13 pm

2jayzgte wrote:20 KW with better boost response who needs to go single hahahahaha..

People who want more than 250kw, and the awesome of a nice single turbo?

BlakeNZ · Post by **BlakeNZ** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 7:53 pm

I think he was referring to himself, already at 315kW, with potential to gain another 20kW.

Mr Ree · Post by **Mr Ree** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:13 pm

Yes 335kw would be a very nice number to get out of a factory looking TT set up

Lith · Post by **Lith** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:42 am

Oh yeah, my bad - that would be really impressive and quite right... much more than that is getting quite serious.