5sfe internals in 3sge

[AE101stylez]

first of all 3sge non interference? or not
would there be much point of triyn to stoke out a 3sge with 5sfe crank and conrods and still using the 3sge piston, would the 5sfe internals be able to handel the revs (7000) or even higher maybe (aftermarket cams?). or should i just forget about it and not waste my time and money

[Akane]

If you wanna have a GE stroker you need the 5S block and the GE head, you have to drill the block out for some water passages. Then you'll need an aftermarket ECU and start spendin' some $$$

[RomanV]

Not true, a guy on MR2OC has a '5sge' setup, and is running the standard gen 3 3sge ECU + loom.

However I think he needed to have custom pistons made.
(Or that may have just been to get the 11:1 compression that he wanted)

[Akane]

Not true, a guy on MR2OC has a '5sge' setup, and is running the standard gen 3 3sge ECU + loom.

However I think he needed to have custom pistons made.
(Or that may have just been to get the 11:1 compression that he wanted)

O RLY?

If you reckon it works then sweet as. Just don't come crying to uncle Akane when your ECU is only providing fuel for a 2L GE spec engine when your engine is 2.2L, and something goes wrong........

[strx7]

the air flow meter will register more air going past and compensate accordingly, well at least it should do. We've put a few 2.5 litre V6 shortblocks into Escudo's which usually have 2L in them and their mixtures are fine, the ecu compensates for the extra airflow, i cant see what a toyota efi system shouldn't do the same

[Adamal]

One question that hasn't been answered (And should have been, Akane and Roman, shame on you both!):

Standard, the 3SGE is a non-interference engine.

Also, the 3SGE is a MAP motor up until the BEAMS engine, which was then AFM.

[Malcolm]

Also, the 3SGE is a MAP motor up until the BEAMS engine, which was then AFM.

Gen 1 was AFM too (flapper door rather than the hotwire on the Beams models though)

[Akane]

AFAIK, the gen 3 3S-GE uses map, which cannot compensate to VE modifications.

If it uses AFM, it will "compensate" to a certain degree, but your A/F and timings will still be a bit off, and IMHO, most cases you'll lose power than what you started off (real 3S-GE)

[RomanV]

(modern) Toyota ECUs can adjust their fuel/ignition maps to +/- 20%....

I doubt that an extra 150something CCs is going to give more than 20% power, it's less than 10% more displacement.

He had his car on the dyno, to check a/f ratios, and it was fine.

Any late model ECU can adjust to suit changes in VE to a certain extent, unless this site lies.

Which is possible, I suppose.

One of the PDFs in there goes into detail about the short term and long term fuel/ignition trim functions of the ECU.

[sergei]

It has been debated many times, but from my experience toyota has long term and short term fuel trim (generation 2+ ecu's with grey plugs, not yellow) wich is +/- 20% from preprogrammed map, and it is designed to adapt to change from wear and general degradation of sensors.
How do I know, by monitoring VF output after reset, in fact this property of ECU makes SAFCs useless. When I was changing fuel values, VF was changing as well and after a while it was stabilising on normal 2.5V, and the change (if it was within 20%) was nullified. Also it affects closed loop settings as well (I think only long term fuel trim). Same rule goes for ignition.

[RomanV]

A few guys with Altezzas noted the same thing, after fitting an SAFC or similar, and trying to lean out their engines slightly.

After a few weeks, the car was back to how it started.
The ecu had 'tuned out' the SAFC.

This would also lend credibility to the 'pull your ecu fuse before putting in a different octane gas' theory.

[fuel]

Haha.. dude why is my car in your avatar pic?

[AE101stylez]

just cos gave it to u it dont mean its urs. ur at uni aye cos i saw it all blak hori in da carpark. more on topic how high revs could the SFE internals handle

[fuel]

just cos gave it to u it dont mean its urs. ur at uni aye cos i saw it all blak hori in da carpark. more on topic how high revs could the SFE internals handle

hey hungarian chill out... when did you see it in the car park? I don't think I've ever taken it to uni before.

And besides, the black can't possibly look worse than how you clowns painted it im still working on all the dents/rust and getting it ready to be painted.

[fuel]

Also back to the topic.

because of the longer stroke of the 5S-FE engine, the piston speed would be faster than the 3S-GE at the same amount of revs. That doesn't necessarily mean it's not going to rev as well - but it's going to reach a maximum piston speed (ie when it all goes bang), alot earlier in the rev range than the 3S-GE.

You would have to muck around with different pistons, rods, crank - and possibly another block.

Probably would be better off with better cams instead.

[overkill]

the air flow meter will register more air going past and compensate accordingly, well at least it should do. We've put a few 2.5 litre V6 shortblocks into Escudo's which usually have 2L in them and their mixtures are fine, the ecu compensates for the extra airflow, i cant see what a toyota efi system shouldn't do the same

low boost AFM turbo applications do the same thing with uprated injectors on stock ecu's

[Akane]

So it injects more fuel than it should when it's offboost?
_b

[overkill]

i worded it badly. rangi mods to ur FPR to change fuel pressure. the inectors will just run full cycle under boost.
i shoulda commented on uprated [/b]injection[b], rather than *different* injectors.

so offboost you still get normal fueling.