ae86 vs. Kp starlet - handling

Volodkovich · Post by **Volodkovich** » Fri Jun 15, 2007 11:10 pm

So, what do you guys think handles better - in modified form.

My thoughts is starlet would prob be quicker on tight courses / autocrosses etc, and the ae86 would be better on full tracks.

The short wheelbase of starlet would lend it to being able to change direction faster, but be more unstable at high speed.

But then, i've never driven either in modified form on the limit.

Discuss..

Burning Angel · Post by **Burning Angel** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 1:31 am

starlets require alot more mods to handle well. theyre set up very conservitaly standard. and theres more aftermaket stuff for ae86. in saying that if you had unlimited dollars im not sure whod win. ae86 longer wheelbase has gotta be an advantage tho

Logan · Post by **Logan** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:53 am

its not hard to add wheel base and have a starlet have the same footprint as an ae86. comes down to weight, and most im0ortantly personal preference

Post by **Mr Revhead** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:18 am

well, if your talking in modified form... its down to how its put together....

they both require replacement parts, but with the starlet a bit more thought/modification is needed, however its certainly not a major effort.

also the starlet is lighter.

so really, theres no cut and dryed answer to that question!

im going to say they are potentially the same. while having the pontential to be a bit different

Burning Angel · Post by **Burning Angel** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:20 am

Logan wrote:its not hard to add wheel base and have a starlet have the same footprint as an ae86. comes down to weight, and most im0ortantly personal preference

i take it you mean add track to the starlet as in width.
im not sure if im correct but by wheel base i mean distance between the front and back wheels which would NOT be easy to change.

just putting a corona diff in my starlet added ~100mm track and putting carina front suspension did about them same in the front

Post by **Mr Revhead** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 9:23 am

if you were making a track starlet, youd go 4 link. its not hard to make the links a bit longer to move the wheels back a bit.

and if making front arms, you can move them forward, a little harder, but a common mod for race cars.

Loudtoy · Post by **Loudtoy** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 6:20 pm

Mr Revhead wrote:
im going to say they are potentially the same. while having the pontential to be a bit different

Lol at you. You obviously been in wellington far to long - your sounding like a politician :lol:

Post by **Mr Revhead** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 6:23 pm

i should sue you for making such slanderous comments!

QikStarlie · Post by **QikStarlie** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 10:34 pm

can increase the wheelbase at the front pretty easy. just move the mounting point for the swaybar forward. will add more castor at the same time. bit hard on the lower arm bushes, if they are still stock though.

frost · Post by **frost** » Sat Jun 16, 2007 11:18 pm

how about comparing track times, any one have time slips around nz tracks of both car and mods list. thats the only way to prove anything, but then again the first post did point out that the starlet would be better for short tracks and ae86 full sooooo apples to oranges

RedMist · Post by **RedMist** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 9:32 am

frost wrote:how about comparing track times, any one have time slips around nz tracks of both car and mods list. thats the only way to prove anything, but then again the first post did point out that the starlet would be better for short tracks and ae86 full sooooo apples to oranges

Dont forget that for the comparison to mean anything they would need to have the same engine, with the same output, with the same gear ratios and final drive, with a similar cage design (for torsional regitity) on the same tyres with the same alignment, the same driver, the same suspension modifications (or appropriately similar)... mmmmm

Its the same old story with everything here. The more money wins. Cheapest compeditive option I personally would go KP. Its stupidly light, very cheap (in comparison with the AE86) has small overhangs and a wheelbase that seems to make it compeditive in most forms of motorsport, and it looks a shyte load better in a TRD kit than the AE86.

frost · Post by **frost** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 2:10 pm

yea but where talking about "all that the car can be" like n1 racing, if they had every thing similar (bar driver) then you'd only be comparing chassis, or was that the first question??? sh!t now im confused what was the question?:D i'd like to see a japan full n1/2 ae86 and kp compete not to prove anything, i just think that'd be really cool.
this comes to mind.

i like my orange thank you

Volodkovich · Post by **Volodkovich** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 2:12 pm

got any more pics frost? looks badass.

I was more thinking about club racer point of view. I would think the differences between them would closen as the more money is spent on the car...

Post by **Mr Revhead** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 2:31 pm

well, if your trying to choose which to build into a track car
iv gone kp61. main reason... ae86 are INSANE in price.

Cahuna · Post by **Cahuna** » Sun Jun 17, 2007 3:21 pm

There are a whole lot of Kp Starlets still involved in club competition in Auckland and from what I've seen they seem to handle well enough. Remember, back in the early '80s they were fast enough in 1300cc form to give some Escorts a hard time in National rallies (in the hands of Dave Strong, Paul Adams etc al). There is no shortage of knowledge in the Clubsport scene as to how to make them handle so I would imagine that the question of which car is best would come down to what driving style you prefer.

Actually, Paul Adams would be a great person to answer that question as he was the "works" driver for Toyota NZ at that time and raced both KP Starlets and an AE86. Presumably both cars would have been modified to the nth degree to get them handling correctly. I'll talk to a friend of mine who was involved with these cars and see if he has any wisdom.

frost · Post by **frost** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 1:55 am

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... 86F002.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... 330_02.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... 012008.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/noae86/GT300.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/noae86/AE86.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... 012009.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... OU0001.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... GI0001.jpg
http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a216/ ... n2ae86.jpg

OMG so shiny! · Post by **Dell'Orto** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:24 pm

Just buy a KE70 while they're still cheap, rear is identical to AE86, all the front stuff can swap over, and its not overly hard to upgrade the front of a KE anyway.
All you need then is a AE70 x member and you've got something that will go and turn like an AE86 for about 1/3 the cost :lol:

Post by **Mr Revhead** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 7:25 pm

yep thats true

Logan · Post by **Logan** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:04 pm

Mmm, Boost wrote:Just buy a KE70 while they're still cheap, rear is identical to AE86, all the front stuff can swap over, and its not overly hard to upgrade the front of a KE anyway.
All you need then is a AE70 x member and you've got something that will go and turn like an AE86 for about 1/3 the cost

I totally agree, and infact its what ive done, but somehow, its just not quite the same......

frost · Post by **frost** » Mon Jun 18, 2007 10:28 pm

^^^

do that and your just a wanabe,

i'd love a ke71 coupe...wait is that what there called?