Blacktop 20V - Cold Air Intake or Panel Filter?

OMG so shiny! · Post by **Dell'Orto** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:24 pm

Yeah was some chap with a 205.

Bling · Post by **Bling** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:46 pm

RobertC wrote:what about this

Would look shiny on the mantle piece, apart from that, a whole lot of effort / money for probably no gain. Years ago a guy down here had one on a GTZ and didn't notice any difference. Apart from it looking funny when parked up in the pits :lol:

xsspeed · Post by **xsspeed** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 5:46 pm

yeah think it was a white st205, guy sold it and everyone wante dto know why it was a 2.2l 3s

Flannelman · Post by **Flannelman** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:04 pm

Just a quick over view.

On a blacktop, pod filters cost power.
On a blacktop, the lower extractor (2-1 section) is a restriction (could be bigger)
On a blacktop, the section through the cross member is crushed so is a restriction (could be bigger also)

Funny thing is that on a silvetop, I have found this.

Pod filters dont let the heat in as much as they suggest. Track tested in in the winter at Taupo, intake temperature was 27C. Temperature change is swift too. Air temp falls so does the intake temp.
Stock silvertop replaced with FGK extractors, 2 1/2 inch after cross member section. Dyno test 78kW to 84kW.
Crushed section replaced with 2 1/2 inch section. 87.3kW to 88.1kW, very little gain.

Because this is on a silvertop Id say they probably dont apply to a blacktop, but still worth saying.

frost · Post by **frost** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:42 pm

that panel filter fmic is so fail,,,
why is there a perspex cover on the filter? to stop any ram air effects?
is there a tornado add on option?

Bling · Post by **Bling** » Wed Jun 23, 2010 11:43 pm

Affroman wrote:Pod filters dont let the heat in as much as they suggest. Track tested in in the winter at Taupo, intake temperature was 27C. Temperature change is swift too.

Most driving is in town though where engine temps get rather warm sitting in traffic etc, which would have a negative affect on having a pod.

watchthisspace · Post by **watchthisspace** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 12:25 am

Moral of this story? Stick to stock for the most part

noted.

RomanV · Post by **RomanV** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:00 am

BZG|Bling wrote:
Affroman wrote:Pod filters dont let the heat in as much as they suggest. Track tested in in the winter at Taupo, intake temperature was 27C. Temperature change is swift too.

Most driving is in town though where engine temps get rather warm sitting in traffic etc, which would have a negative affect on having a pod.

Hot air being less dense is irrelevant when around town, because when you're at part throttle you're intentionally limiting the amount of air coming in anyway.

Since there's also such a small volume of air going in, additional chance of detonation isnt going to be an issue either.

Flannelman · Post by **Flannelman** » Thu Jun 24, 2010 4:38 pm

Yea, I failed to mention that I got a 53C reading in traffic during summer...

pc · Post by pc » Thu Jun 24, 2010 5:40 pm

Affroman wrote:Just a quick over view.

On a blacktop, pod filters cost power.

Just curious, how was the power difference measured & how was the pod filter installed?... and what were the numbers?

eskimo · Post by **eskimo** » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:12 pm

So after reading through this thread im better to leave the K&N panel filter in the standard air box over fitting trumpets and socks to my AE111

Kittah · Post by **Kittah** » Mon Jun 28, 2010 8:19 pm

eskimo wrote:So after reading through this thread im better to leave the K&N panel filter in the standard air box over fitting trumpets and socks to my AE111

Yes. Unless you've got an appropriately-tuned aftermarket ECU and other bits and pieces, you will always see a power drop if you ditch the factory plenum.

Bling · Post by **Bling** » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:33 pm

eskimo wrote:So after reading through this thread im better to leave the K&N panel filter in the standard air box over fitting trumpets and socks to my AE111

Yes, BUT, if you're happy to lose power across the board until you reach 7krpm, trumpets do sound cool :lol:

When I had trumpets I would get a bit of torque steer happening at 7k. K&N Panel ftw. I run that in completely factory intake and works fine. I've had all 3 options and the car felt fastest with panel filter in. Slowest with open trumpets. Only seat of pants dyno though :lol:

RomanV · Post by **RomanV** » Mon Jun 28, 2010 9:58 pm

BZG|Bling wrote: I've had all 3 options and the car felt fastest with panel filter in. Slowest with open trumpets. Only seat of pants dyno though

'Aaahh well that's the thing with SOP dyno...

My car felt quicker when it had 20kw ATW less and a shiteload less low end and midrange...

Actual dyno results were surprising to say the least.

Bling · Post by **Bling** » Mon Jun 28, 2010 11:37 pm

Was a noticeable lack of low down torque with open trumpets, seat of pants or not. Even more so for a 20v anyway. For all I know it might make more power with open trumpets, but with redline at 8k I would never find out :lol:

pc · Post by pc » Tue Jun 29, 2010 6:39 pm

Kittah wrote:
eskimo wrote:So after reading through this thread im better to leave the K&N panel filter in the standard air box over fitting trumpets and socks to my AE111

Yes. Unless you've got an appropriately-tuned aftermarket ECU and other bits and pieces, you will always see a power drop if you ditch the factory plenum.

Has anyone proved that anywhere here with a proper cold airbox and a dyno?

RomanV · Post by **RomanV** » Tue Jun 29, 2010 9:47 pm

Well there's only limited merit in using a dyno...

It shows how much power your car makes when sitting still.

If you've got your air intake positioned in a high pressure area on the front of the car, there is potential gains at speed, that arent shown on a dyno.

Kittah · Post by **Kittah** » Wed Jun 30, 2010 2:00 pm

pc wrote:Has anyone proved that anywhere here with a proper cold airbox and a dyno?

What I said excludes a cold air intake completely; I was talking about running the trumpets completely open.

Flannelman · Post by **Flannelman** » Wed Jun 30, 2010 2:44 pm

Dyno of my car when I got it, pod, exhaust = 78kW

Dyno of mates car, stock everything and running lean = 77kW

Dynoed on different days and at different mileage, but on the same dyno

pc · Post by pc » Wed Jun 30, 2010 5:40 pm

I haven't actually dyno'd the difference between factory & pod setup, but I have dyno'd the same bluetop in 2 different cars with factory IHE on one car (minus the cat) and modified IHE on my race car with cold air box.

There was more power and torque across the whole range on the race car with the peak numbers being 75.5KW vs 81.2KW

I'm assuming the exhaust was rather important, but unfortunatly I don't know which had the most effect and how much.